# what's gone wrong?



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

Hi, I don't understand what's happened and I am not sure what to do. 

Recently, I posted on here about Pixel having accidents every night in her cage and tried to follow advice about looking at her routine. She had one dry night and I thought everything was ok but no she's back to having accidents. I try and remember to pick her water up after 7, however when my hubby is looking after her he forgets and it's down when I get home at 9.00pm. However, it doesn't seem to make any difference either way.

I take her out for the toilet just before she goes to bed but she doesn't go and just lies down in the garden so I put her in her cage thinking she doesn't need it but then she goes in her cage. This is even happening when my hubby puts her in her cage at 8.00am and I get home at 1.00am when she has gone longer than that before without an accident.

However, things have got much worse now. She seems to have got in the habit not only of going to the loo (wee) in her cage but also making a racket by stratching the door in the middle of the night. She woke us up at 3.30am this morning for the second night running which has not done since the first night we got her 7 weeks ago. She has towels down on the floor of her cage and it has a bottom which is moveable. She stratches at the door continuously and the whole cage rattles and the towels are bunched up in the corner when I let her out. She is very noisey. She seems to do this even when left for short periods when she hasn't done it before. 

When I went down yesterday in the middle of the night, she raced out but wasn't that bothered about seeing me or going out for the toilet but raced into the kitchen to the cat's bowl and the cat's bed so I assumed it was because she had heard the cat, but the cat comes in most nights since we've got her and she hasn't done this.

The same thing happended this morning. I ignored her following my mum's advice but she carried on for ages and I didn't like the idea of her being distressed. However, again she didn't seem that bothered by me and although she went out into the garden it didn't seem like she needed the toilet. I put her back in and she had still had an accident when I let her out again at 6.50am. 

It may be my fault as I have always rushed down in the morning when I have heard her stratching at the door as I was worried she was stressed or needed the loo. At first she could hardly hold her wee until I got her out in the garden but now she doesn't even seem that desperate for the toilet when I let her out. Now it seems like a behaviour thing. She also does this in her box in the car too but it doesn't seem to be because she wants to get out in that case, it seems to be when dust/bits are on the floor as she loves her car box and goes straight in it when I get it out. She stops doing it when I say no and goes to sleep.

I am not sure what to do as I don't want to be woken up at 3.30am every morning or have to carry on washing towels everyday. So I am keen for this to stop. I wondering if no towels would be better.


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

sorry, i should add. She doesn't do this when we put her in at night and had always gone straight to sleep. Also, this morning she stopped doing it as soon as she heard I was put even though it was another 20 mins before I actually let her out. I don't normally do this, I normally let her straight out but I wanted to see if she would it once she knew I was awake.


----------



## lady amanda (Nov 26, 2010)

Just an idea...how big is her crate? how much room does she have at night?


----------



## lady amanda (Nov 26, 2010)

and...are you covering the crate at night??


----------



## caradunne (Nov 29, 2010)

I am wondering whether she is confined in her cage too much? It is hard to work out from your post what your routine is. Do you both work so that she is at home alone most of the day? Is she getting walked enough and mentally stimulated often enough? How old is Pixel?


----------



## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

Hi. I really feel for you as we go through a similar thing with Daisy. We can get her in the crate fine at bedtime but my son woke up this morning at 4am shouting for me which in turn woke Daisy up and then that was it, she was off barking and whining. She also scratches at the corner of the crate and the whole thing shakes. She has even managed to burst out of hers!  It is a rubbish crate! 

Anyway... What time do you put her to bed? I have the same issue with Daisy about laying on the grass. I pick her up, run around, throw a ball, anything to get her up however if that all fails I just put her in the crate for the night.

I always use the same command 'in your bed' and then whether I have to put her in or she goes by herself I always give her a high value reward such as chicken or sausage.

Is the cat disturbing her? Daisy desperately wants to play with our cat and barks and gets very excited when she sees him. I have had to shut cetain doors at night so that the cat can't walk passed Daisy's crate as I think this was one of the things that was unsettling her. When she is more sensible around the cat I will change it.  Could you do anything similar?

I was getting up in the night when I heard Daisy. I would let her out without saying a word and then putting her straight back in her crate afterwards. This was when I was sleeping downstairs though. If I was you, I would ignore the noise, they shouldn't be waking up at this time really. I know the accidents are annoying but maybe they will stop after a few nights of ignoring?

I can only relate your descriptions to what we are going through but hope this might be a help in some way.


----------



## ali-s.j. (Jun 6, 2011)

I can't offer much advice, and certainly none better than previous posts - except for towels - have you thought of puppy pads? You can buy holders for them in pets at home to keep them in place, it'll save the washing at least 
I would certainly try not to give in and get up to Pixel, it's really tough, but sometimes tough love is what you need 
I do hope things improve for you soon :hug:


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

Hi, thanks for all the comments. It's just so strange as no problems with this before, she's normally my alarm clock for 7.00am! 

I do wonder if part of the problem has been lack of routine. I am a teacher so have had the summer hols off work but have worked part-time so her routine has been very changeable. I've also been working 3 evenings a week and my hubby has her a night thoose days but I am there the other ones. But I haven't worked in the day for the last two weeks so she has had me alot. On non-work days she has a 45 min walk at lunch time and then my hubby gives her a walk in the evenings and she is put in her cage about 5.00 until he gets home about 8.00pm. On my work days she gets a 15 minute walk in the morning, let out at lunch by my hubby and a nice 45 minute walk when I get home at about 4.00pm. Recently, she has had a 45 minute walk in the day but I have found she does need two walks really so have started giving her a small one in the evening again.

I have taken her to work with me a few times in the evening. I start work again this week so we will be in a much better routine now and I finish working the three evenings.

Her cage is a medium one and is quite big so she doesn't have to lie on the wee when she does it. So it is bigger than it's meant to be. I think I will try and get her up and running around when I take her out for a wee just before bed like you suggested and see if that makes her go. Before, she just used to go practically on demand! I don't cover the cage as I have run out of towels! 

I think the cat is distubing her but the cat is shut in the kitchen/outside and she is in another room with the door shut so they don't see each other. This has never been a problem before though.


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

she's a clever girl though, that's why I think she knows what she's doing as isn't distressed and doesn't seem to need the toilet. I tried to do some training with her today. I put her in her crate and picked up her paws to stratch the towel and door like she does and said no several times. Then I closed the door and walked away. Everytime she started stratching I did the same thing, touching her paws everytime I said no. I did this several times and then just before I was actually going out properly to the supermarket. When I came back (after about half an hor) her towel was in place and there had been no stratching. I praised her and gave her a treat. Not sure if she'll remember this all night though.


----------



## ali-s.j. (Jun 6, 2011)

Cleo, with all you have described, maybe it would be an idea to go back to the beginning, treat tonight as night 1, and introduce the routine you would like. Sarah has had to train Daisy from scratch, at about 5 months, it took time and tears, but she has achieved so much. We're all here for moral support :hug:


----------



## lady amanda (Nov 26, 2010)

often if pups have the space to pee and not ie near it then they will do so maybe think about making the crate a little smaller so that she doesnt have the space to go....they don't want to mess up their den...so this might help...if you have a blanket covering her crate to make it dark helps to keep them asleep as it is darker. 

Good luck with her...and this defiantly could be caused by the change in routine recently.


----------



## caradunne (Nov 29, 2010)

Is she now at the naughty teenage type phase? She is intelligent and maybe is getting bored for such long periods in her crate. At night she knows you are there and wants attention. Is there a place she could be safe and free during some of the day time whe n you are not there? The change in routine will also upset her and she will soon get back on track once the routine is re-established. Good luck, they go through very trying times these gorgeous little pooches!


----------



## Dexter1011 (Aug 28, 2011)

Hi, just an idea but I wondered if it had been very windy where you live as where I am in Essex it has been more windy and things have been blowing round the garden.


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

no scratching in the middle of the night last night so maybe one off, but an accident again when I came down in the morning, even though she had me all afternoon and night. Was fed at normal time and had no water after 7.00pm. 

I think I will find something to put over the cage to keep it dark at night. I will try and find something to block some of her cage off-not sure what though as she likes to stred anything cardboard or eatable- what does everyone else use? We're thinking of buying her another cage for when my hubby takes her to work with him incase she needs some chill out time or wants a sleep when there so could get her a small one and have that as her night one. Or maybe it's just her bladder as every dog is different and she is so good in every other area.

Cara, I disagree with you it's because she's bored. She is not in her cage for long periods of time. I think she is probably in her cage a lot less than most dogs who's owners work as most people are not lucky enough to get home at 3.30-4.00pm like me or leave home as late in the morning as my hubby does. Someone comes home at lunchtime to let her out and she is played with and taken on lots of walks. She gets lots of attention/cuddles etc and has lots of toys to keep her occupied. My hubby takes her to work if I am going to be a little late getting home and I take her to work in the evening if my hubby is going to be late.


----------



## M&M's mummy (Jul 12, 2011)

I think you may be right about having no routine as they seem to like routine.

If you can get a more set routine I think this will help loads.

Also at night put a blanket or sheet over the back and sides of crate to make it more den like will hopefully help her settle through the night too.


----------



## Happyad (Oct 5, 2010)

Simple things. 
She's growing up so her senses become more keen. Ie hearing the cat and smelling the cat. 
Also scent, since she's started messing in her crate it smell like somewhere to mess. Strip down, vinegar spray and hose off the crate. Not just the towels. 
She's got a routine that u nearly fell into " best go and sort her out she must need the loo". After 16 weeks or so the bladder muscles become stronger so if they wish they can start to hold for longer. Ie when u come down on a morning def don't let her out first. She's at a massive learning age and what happens now can get more difficult to un do. 
So in short clean the lot, don't give up and restart daytime potty training. 
If u can crate her post meals, 20 mins later out for a wee, with a command word, then pop her back in ten mins later out and I bet she'll poo then. 
The aim being that she will potty on request, which is great at 11pm when we all just need to go to bed!


----------



## Happyad (Oct 5, 2010)

Oh and the thick blanket over the cage, total winner!


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

thanks guys, i am planning on putting a blanket over the cage tonight. Adam, I will try the not letting her out straight away routine and see how it goes. I did it the other day and she did stop stratching. Still a wee though, so think she must do that the minute she wakes up.


----------



## Blossomgirl (Jul 21, 2011)

Hi, have you tried treats when she wees outside and praise? I have a big blanket over Blossoms cage and I cut a strong bit of cardboard to divide her cage to make it smaller - fits top to bottom and side to side so she cant get hold of it to chew it. If you think its a behavioural prob you could get a personal trainer round to help you out (Ive got one coming next wed for Blossom as she is growling outside - I hope he works!!) Good luck.xxx


----------



## Happyad (Oct 5, 2010)

I thought personal trainer was what I had at the gym LOL


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

hey. I am going to cut some cardboard for her today and try and make her cage smaller. 

Well this morning I ignored her when she started scratching and it all went quiet after a few minutes and she must have gone to sleep again. I got up 15 minutes later and let her out. But there was a wee, which was very wet so I think she did it when she was scratching and then went back to sleep after weeing. So maybe I should go straight down tomorrow morning when I hear her, but from experience there will still be a wee!

Hubby reckons I should leave ther dirty towel in for the next night and so she won't want to wee on it again and she won't like the small as she does it because she knows she'll get a nice new towel if she wees. Or take the towel away completely. Are dogs really that clever? Would this work or is it a bit mean?

As for cleaning the cage I am going to do this today.


----------



## Blossomgirl (Jul 21, 2011)

Happyad said:


> I thought personal trainer was what I had at the gym LOL


lol I feel such an inexperienced first time puppy mum so I have what ever you call them behaviouralist coming over to give me tips and make sure I am doing it all right (luckily doesnt cost to much and he is good apparently).xx

Good luck with Pixel Im sure she will get there.xx


----------



## ali-s.j. (Jun 6, 2011)

Cleo, this morning I got up earlier than I have been since Izzy has been out of her crate, and she hadn't done a wee, maybe it's worth pre-empting the scratching with Pixel? Yhat's what I did when we first had Izzy home, and gradually lengthened the time. I think leaving the dirty towel would send the mesage that this is the place to wee.


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

ok thanks. Yeah will try getting up earlier and will be doing that anyway as will be getting up earlier for work now. I did get up at 5.00am the first few nights and then 6.00am and then 6.30 over the first week and there was always a wee no mattter what time but I will try again.


----------



## ali-s.j. (Jun 6, 2011)

I haven't gone back to the beginning of the thread - do you hear her cry in the night?


----------



## caradunne (Nov 29, 2010)

cleo said:


> Cara, I disagree with you it's because she's bored. She is not in her cage for long periods of time. I think she is probably in her cage a lot less than most dogs who's owners work as most people are not lucky enough to get home at 3.30-4.00pm like me or leave home as late in the morning as my hubby does. Someone comes home at lunchtime to let her out and she is played with and taken on lots of walks. She gets lots of attention/cuddles etc and has lots of toys to keep her occupied. My hubby takes her to work if I am going to be a little late getting home and I take her to work in the evening if my hubby is going to be late.


Hi, I wasn't in any way trying to be critical of you as you have made a huge effort to make sure she is fine, I was just wondering if her age was having an impact. Sorry if I didn't express this very well. xx


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

ok, cara no worries. Well the stratching in the night (as far as I know) has stopped- guess it might just be that something spooked her or it was windy night. 

And I came down to a dry towel this morning. She woke up at 7.00 as usual and I did go straight down. I guess she scratches because she just can't wait to wee. I hope is she gets older she can go longer soon. I put the blanket over the cage at night too so guess this might work so will continue to do this. Hope it lasts and I am not back on in a few days saying she's weeing again.


----------



## ali-s.j. (Jun 6, 2011)

Hey, that's good news Cleo  My hubby got up this morning (I'm feeling a bit under the weather) to poo on the rug! After yesterday (when I got up earlier) I thought we may have turned the corner, I really don't want to go back to crating Izzy at night, she loves being with Phoebe, but I don't know what else to do if she won't wait to go out


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

what time do you give her dinner or anything to eat at night time? Or can she get to food during the night? I find that Pixel goes to the loo about half an hour to an hour after eating and then that's it she doesn't need to go again until she has brekkie. Maybe try and feed her earlier and have no treats late at night-if you are not already doing this.


----------



## ali-s.j. (Jun 6, 2011)

That's the first time she's done a poo overnight in weeks! I think it may have been because my son let her out last thing and didn't wait for her to sniff about ! The wees are the thing, and it's only been since Sunday. Before that she's been dry since day 3 (7 weeks ago) The obvious thing is being free to roam, she wan't doing it in the crate, I just really don't want to put her back in, but I think I may have to


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

Grr. She's still wetting her towel in her cage. I have put her in a routine, as advised, in that we go to bed about the same time every evening, her water is picked up at 7.00pm and she is taken to the toilet just before bed and we make sure she has a wee. I have been covering her cage with a towel. She knows when it's bed time and has a toy in her cage with her.

However, I have tried to wait until 7.00am even if she is scratching to let her out but when I do she always wets the cage, so again I am fed up with washing towels everyday. I think I am going to go back to letting her out straight away as I feel she is scratching because she needs the loo not to get out the cage as it all goes quiet when I try and make her wait which makes me think she has been to the loo. Then she might scratch again and I'll go down because it's 7.00 am and there will be two wet patches not one. But I am worried in future this will mean she scratches when she wants to come out not neccessarily when she needs the loo. She's 20 weeks now, is it unreasonable to expect her to go dry from 10.15/10.30pm to 7.00am? If not when should this start to happen? I know each dog is different but she can go dry but only if I rush down as soon as she wakes up.

Also, what does everyone do at the weekend? I am feeling tired of having no lie in EVER! It's ok in the week but I was ill last weekend and it was horrible. I've tried putting her in the garden/kitchen but she barks and I worry about her waking the neighbours so end up going back down. I've tried leaving her in the hall but she whines at the bottom of the stairs. At both times she has a pigs ear/bone/toys and this keeps her happy for a short while. I thinking I might have to start putting her back in her cage.


----------



## colpa110 (Jul 5, 2011)

Hi Cleo

I can HEAR your frustration. Betty is only a couple of weeks older. She has
NEVER wee'd or poo'd in her crate ( from day one) and also NEVER poo'd in the house BUT I have a dog minder that takes Betty out from about 11.00am
until about 2.30pm each weekd day - in the morning there are never ANY puddles according to the sitter but I ALWAYS come home to puddles in the evening. It seems that extra hour in the afternoon is just too long for her to hold it - although she can hold for ten hours overnight as she's never eager
to get up in the morning and happy to stay in her cage until we let her out
( weekend sometimes till nearly 9.00am). I guess what I'm saying is that they are all different and we all have our frustrations but they all get there in the
end ( or so I'm told!!) . Good luck..


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

oh lucky you. I wish Pixel would sleep in. She's so eager to explore everything and anything I think she feels she's missing out on the world if she isn't out her cage at the crack of dawn! We make sure she's very very tired at night when she is put in it.

Must be annoying clearing up a wee everytime you get home though. Pixel has never pooed in the house and only weed for the first few weeks until she learnt to use the cat door and has always slept through the night (apart from once) so guess I should count my blessings.


----------



## S.Claire (Sep 1, 2011)

Hi Cleo

I have realised, If I put Nacho to bed at 10pm I have to get up at 6.30am to let him out (I then go back to sleep quite easily). If I put Nacho to bed at 11pm, I don't have to get up until 7.30am which really means he just cant hold it any longer than 8 and half hours otherwise he'll have an accident. Nacho is 19 weeks old. Sounds like Pixel has her limit too and you may just need to work out what time that is. In terms of lie-ins, I am one of those lucky people who can get up, let Nacho out and put him back in his crate again, then start snoring within seconds once my head has hit the pillow. 

During the day, Nacho is different and definitely needs to wee more frequently. I think this is because he is awake a lot more and is with me so 'wees' are on his mind more than when he sleeps throughout the night. Hope this helps a bit and good luck x


----------



## cleo (Aug 31, 2011)

Hi

I will try and stay up longer and see if that works. I have taken to falling asleep on the sofa at night I am so tired with early mornings with her but will do my best.

I used to be like, I would sleep through anything but as I've got older (I am only 30!) I've noticed I just cannot sleep like I used to and if I do she wakes me up again at weekends after about a hour whining or barking. I am going to put her back in her cage and see if that makes her go back to sleep.


----------



## Mogdog (Feb 6, 2011)

Hi Cleo,

Pixel is still young and I'm sure it takes more time with some dogs ... nice for you she is good in all other ways ... and it doesn't sound like she has accidents during the day.

You could switch to newspaper or puppy pads for her crate ... must be frustrating to do so much towel washing.

Bess is 18 weeks and has finally become more reliable during the day ... not 100% reliable yet though ... it's taken longer with her than with Maisie. She is no longer in a crate overnight but restricted to the kitchen ... she usually has an accident (on newspaper near door). Don't know how long this will continue but am not too concerned ... the newspaper can be disposed of easily and I'm sure she will "get it" sometime soon. We find she settles more happily when not in a crate (the 2 dogs like to sleep together) and makes no noise in the night, so it works for us. 

Good luck ... consistency is the key, whichever way you decide to play it. Keep us posted. x


----------



## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

Oh dear, I really feel for you! I have to get up at 5.45am so that I can be showerd and dressed and be downstairs by about 6.15am otherwise Daist starts to stress. Even at the weekend I set my alarm for 6am, come down in my dressing gown and then after letting her out try and have a nap on the sofa! Mine is more of a anxiety issue, if I leave it any later I come down to a very stressed out dog who has been panting and covered herself in drool! Nice ! But the late nights and early mornings and completely wearing me out . Good luck, I really hope things improve for you. x


----------



## Sara (Aug 15, 2011)

*Don't Worry*

Hi Cleo,

I have read through all the feeds and I would say Pixel is completely normal and will definately settle down. I am sorry to say that Eric was exactly the same and wasn't fully house trained during the evening until he was about 5-6 months old. We do have a very hectic schedule though and he doesn't always eat at the same time every day so his routine was disorganised. He coped with the disorganisation prefectly but just was unpredicatable in the evenings. 

My advice is tough love does work. Do not let Pixel run your life within reason. I too am 30 and felt like I was 80 for the first 6 months of having Eric what with all the early mornings. 

We used to crate Eric initially and close the door but he rattled the cage when he wanted out. We then opened the crate door but covered the crate with an old blanket and put a puppy pad at the back door and locked him in the kitchen during the evening. He had the run of the kitched and would always use the pad to go to the loo. He slept in the crate and only woke us around 6.30-7.00am to play. 

A good tip is that whenever you arrive back home or let pixel out, ignore her for 15mins every time. Giving her attention as soon as you entre a room is reinforcing her behaviour. 

All dogs are different though. 

Sara & Eric.


----------

