# Hi - some advise needed



## tlow (Dec 16, 2016)

Hi Everyone - thought I would join up this forum as me and my wife are picking up our little cockapoo puppy in a few days.! 

We are thinking the best way to help the little pup get happy with its new home and family would be to cage train it in the kitchen where the floors etc are similar to its current surroundings. This will be our first dog. 

I have read that it might be better to keep the pup in the cage next to our bed so we can take it for a wee or poo if its needed during the night. is this a better option? 

failing that we will just put a bed out with some puppy pee mats down in the kitchen for it until it can be fully trained to go in the garden after we have taken it for its two vaccinations. 

Thanks

Tony


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## tlow (Dec 16, 2016)

Here he is..


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## tlow (Dec 16, 2016)

More pics..


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## Cat 53 (Aug 26, 2012)

Oh what a sweet little pup. Love his little white blaze. Ok, I'm biased, I loathe cages. I've always used a dog box. Tiny to start with, as they are so little. I've also had a little pup sleep on my bed with me. ( no crying and howling in fear, loneliness and distress that way). Just my view of course. It's based on a book I read many years ago, about how to raise a puppy. I tried it and since then I've been converted. I never leave my puppies to cry alone.


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## Annabellam (Nov 3, 2015)

Congratulations! Whether you decide to keep it in the kitchen nights or in the bedroom, you're still going to have to deal with waste disposal. The piddle place is a fully enclosed chamber with a drain valve system meaning there are no spills. I'd recommend. I kept Sammy in my room when he was little on his own bed next to mine.


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## tlow (Dec 16, 2016)

We had a tough night on his first night with us, we had him in our room with us however he gets really scared during the night and cries until we spend 5 mins with him and calm him down. We decided (due to no sleep at all pretty much!) that we would leave him downstairs and try to ignore the crying as much as possible especially when we have recently let him out for his pee and poo's. He is picking this up really quickly which is great.

I feel like each day he is becoming more and more comfortable, however on his second night in the kitchen he was crying at around 3am - we had an alarm set to get up and let him out for wee anyway at about 3.30am as he was due one. to cut a long story short! the neighbour came round about 5 mins into his crying and banged on the door as hard as she could and told us that we are cruel for letting it cry. she started shouting saying its keeping her awake (which is understandably annoying and I totally understand)

I know that with a bit of time he will get better but its only his second night and with the neighbour already showing hostility to us we have now moved him to the living room for tonight so the neighbour can hear less. 

im not sure whether this is the right approach however we feel he needs to learn that crying when we leave him downstairs wont get him what he wants. which is to come out the crate and see us and play! 

Obviously we don't ignore all his cries and we regularly set alarms to check on him. fingers crossed these crying fits don't last much longer as im worried the neighbour will file a complaint against us and the puppy. she cant seem the grasp the fact he has only been away from mum and siblings for 2 days!!!


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## 2ndhandgal (Aug 29, 2011)

As pups are babies away from everything they know for the first time I would much rather give them the love and comfort they need than leave them to cry it out alone.


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## tlow (Dec 16, 2016)

2ndhandgal said:


> As pups are babies away from everything they know for the first time I would much rather give them the love and comfort they need than leave them to cry it out alone.


I agree with what you are saying, he does get a lot of love! we aren't just leaving him crying for hours on end! on the other hand we have been there with him whilst crying and he's gone straight to sleep after 8 to 9 mins. 

Every thing I have read online states that separation training is very important with small pups. which is why we feel we should not run to his side EVERY time he cries. if he doesn't settle after 10 mins - we go in and give him love.


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## Lexi&Beemer (May 5, 2013)

I take information on the internet with a grain of salt. Truthfully, leaving your pup to sleep by himself doesn't teach him not to have separation anxiety. However, responding to him if the crying goes on for 10 minutes does teach him he just need to wait it out because you will only come if he cries long enough. 

The only way leaving him will work is tough it out for a couple of days. But also let your neighbors know. Maybe some home made muffins or Starbucks gift card as a we are so sorry but let's nip the crying as a team. 

Mostly take the perspective of your puppy. A few nights ago, he was sleeping all on top of each other with his brothers and sisters and mom, now he's all by himself. Put a used tshirt with your scent in his crate, wrap a warm bottle or those things that mimic his litter mates (you can buy these) in with him. Play soft music for him whenever he's sleeping so it becomes a cue for Sleep. 

I did the crate thing mostly because I was worried that they'd wake up and get into something or have an accident in bed. They were in my room, but based on the advice of the internet, I created my two separately. If I could do it over again, I'd put them together. I think the separation actually made them more anxious. And it wasn't until we all slept together in my bed that we all had a full nights sleep. This was what ended up working for us and others have done it differently. The key is to be consistent and he will learn. 


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## tlow (Dec 16, 2016)

Lexi&Beemer said:


> I take information on the internet with a grain of salt. Truthfully, leaving your pup to sleep by himself doesn't teach him not to have separation anxiety. However, responding to him if the crying goes on for 10 minutes does teach him he just need to wait it out because you will only come if he cries long enough.
> 
> The only way leaving him will work is tough it out for a couple of days. But also let your neighbors know. Maybe some home made muffins or Starbucks gift card as a we are so sorry but let's nip the crying as a team.
> 
> ...


thanks very much for your response! its good advise so thank you! 

regarding the teaching him we will come if he cries for a longer time do you think it would be more beneficial to just comfort and settle him every time he wakes up and cries? or should we just ignore if we know he doesn't need to go outside and do his jobs. I am open to trying anything to make him feel better during the night for his sake!.

I really feel like we are making good progress with him, he is a very happy pup and absolutely loves us already! the neighbour thing just maybe rocked the boat a little and made us question our efforts.


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## 2ndhandgal (Aug 29, 2011)

There are two approaches and you seem to be mixed in what you are using.

I prefer the happy puppy who is somewhere they feel secure and does not feel the need to cry so will be overnight in my room initially as close as they need to be to not be worried.

The other approach is to leave to cry full stop - works for some but I am afraid not for me


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## Lexi&Beemer (May 5, 2013)

tlow said:


> thanks very much for your response! its good advise so thank you!
> 
> 
> 
> ...




One of the things to think about is how you plan to go from this point on. Do you want your dog to stay in the kitchen or somewhere not in your bedroom than you need to persevere. Tho he is still little and may need a break. I used the one hour for every month rule. So I took them out at 11pm, woke up at 2pm. And early morning wake up between 4:30 and 5. But I also had a schedule I could nap during the day when they did. I do think had I let them sleep together or even with me, we would have slept all night. Now when I have to pee in the middle of the night, they sleep right through and will go back to bed so long as it is dark out after their early morning pee. So we snooze. My dogs also sleep with me, often sandwiched in an odd way, but we all sleep much better together. 

If you want to keep him out of the bedroom, plenty of people do that. You just need to be consistent and let your neighbors know. It's really a matter of your choice. Also lots of very happy puppies who sleep in their crates and in other rooms. I do think you will have to make some adjustments. I think there's a toy or something that mimics heartbeats so he won't feel alone. You may also want to do a food/drink/play/sleep/pee/poop diary. Noting the times each occurs. That will help you predict when you may need to get up without your little guy needing to tell you he needs to go. 

And think about principles of reinforcement. The behavior you reinforce by going to him is that which occurred before. And waiting when he's quiet before you go to him doesn't teach him not to bark, because you didn't go to him when he was quiet before he was barking. He learns you come when he stops barking, which requires him to bark. My two have trained this well in me.  these guys are smart. Also - don't buy into the stuff you read that once a dog is a certain way by week (fill in the blank), your dog is permanently (blank). This just causes pet owner anxiety and gets in the way of your relationship with your pup. Building that relationship is ongoing. And just as we learn, they can too. 


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## tlow (Dec 16, 2016)

Lexi&Beemer said:


> One of the things to think about is how you plan to go from this point on. Do you want your dog to stay in the kitchen or somewhere not in your bedroom than you need to persevere. Tho he is still little and may need a break. I used the one hour for every month rule. So I took them out at 11pm, woke up at 2pm. And early morning wake up between 4:30 and 5. But I also had a schedule I could nap during the day when they did. I do think had I let them sleep together or even with me, we would have slept all night. Now when I have to pee in the middle of the night, they sleep right through and will go back to bed so long as it is dark out after their early morning pee. So we snooze. My dogs also sleep with me, often sandwiched in an odd way, but we all sleep much better together.
> 
> If you want to keep him out of the bedroom, plenty of people do that. You just need to be consistent and let your neighbors know. It's really a matter of your choice. Also lots of very happy puppies who sleep in their crates and in other rooms. I do think you will have to make some adjustments. I think there's a toy or something that mimics heartbeats so he won't feel alone. You may also want to do a food/drink/play/sleep/pee/poop diary. Noting the times each occurs. That will help you predict when you may need to get up without your little guy needing to tell you he needs to go.
> 
> ...


What a difference a few days make. He was happy as Larry last night, cried once - went straight to see him and let him out, did what he needed to do and then went straight back into his crate to sleep till 8 am! 

My anxiety levels have been through the roof these last couple of days! he has learnt so quickly. thanks for everyone's input. goes to show time and patience with a lot of love is all that's needed


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## Lexi&Beemer (May 5, 2013)

tlow said:


> What a difference a few days make. He was happy as Larry last night, cried once - went straight to see him and let him out, did what he needed to do and then went straight back into his crate to sleep till 8 am!
> 
> 
> 
> My anxiety levels have been through the roof these last couple of days! he has learnt so quickly. thanks for everyone's input. goes to show time and patience with a lot of love is all that's needed




Awesomesauce! Seriously it's all about rethinking what a win really is. And it sounds like you have made progress. Do be kind with yourself. Nothing short of abuse or neglect will do "damage". The rest is easily corrected. Also no one person has the "right" way. Some adjustments are required for your situation, your poo, and even who you are. Ask questions. And have confidence in the love you obviously have for your puppy baby.


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## tlow (Dec 16, 2016)

thought Id come back to you for an update on this. Ralph is now 15 weeks and is loving life! 

He sleeps perfectly and we are just trying to get through the dreaded 'puppy biting stage'. He's enjoying puppy school and seems to just want to be best friends with absolutely everyone who walks past him!









Here is a more recent pic:



Hopefully he will stop the nipping and ankle chasing soon! he is definitely worth all the hard work and lack of lie ins


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## Marzi (Sep 17, 2012)

How cute is he?
Congratulations on sorting the sleeping....
There are so many 'stages' that puppies go through, but it is worth it - so worth it.
Enjoy him.


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