# "BARF" a la Jukee Doodles.



## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

We used to just feed all our dogs on Purina Pro-Plan - then changed to BARF in an instant once we had done the homework on what it entailed and once we had sourced a stable supply of carcasses. We had also noted that our dogs were getting fussy about what "flavour" kibble the shop actually had in stock at any time - so the change-over was kibble one day - RAW meaty bones the next - and that was 2 years ago - and we have never looked back.

The benefits to - Health; Coat; Teeth; Breath and Vitality showed itself quickly as well as the poo - which was almost odourless; less of it AND it if was not picked-up straight away - it dried to a white chalky pellet that almost turned to dust if disturbed.

We moved the weening of the puppies across to Royal Canin (Medium Junior 32) as Ziggy's offspring were notably smaller than our previous stud Poodle Pinot's - and we needed a smaller kibble.

It was on ILMC that we first heard of Natural Instinct and Orijen - as our adult dogs were all on "our" version of BARF (as there are so many differing menus as such - inc fish etc) we really wanted the puppies to also have a more natural diet (especially as "cereals" were a "no-no" for us). 

We looked into NI - but all we would need is to liquify what we fed our adults - BUT realised it was a big ask to expect our customers to carry it on - knowing most would just go onto a kibble for convenience's sake - so Orijen fitted the bill ! A natural diet all in kibble form - and now all our puppies are weened onto that - and we give a sample 400g bag with each puppy in the puppy pack (along with Tropiclean Shampoo and De-Tangle Conditioner !).

Another unforeseen benefit to us was that Mum used to stop cleaning up after her pups when they were being weened - but with Orijen - she still cleaned up right until when she left them at 7 1/2 weeks old ! 

With all the excitement about BARF and Natural diets - I thought that I would show you all how we do things here:


The JD BARF:

We feed each of our adult dogs a single RAW chicken carcass every day (a raw chicken minus wings; legs and breasts - what most restaurants buy-in for making stock):




















Once a month we prepare a "veg" mix (though this does have meat as an ingredient).
We get - broccoli; cauliflower; swedes; turnips; carrots; greens; cabbage and often add - apples and pears too:










We chop all these up into "soup" size bites - the pic shows just a "Mum Mix" for the 10 mums):

This veg mix is then lightly steamed - as to make it "al dente" - not over cooked:












We then slice and dice any "offal" such as kidneys; liver and dog mince and just add that straight into the warm veg bucket:

































Top that with more steamed veg as it is ready:












And add the eggs (raw and including the shells) to the still warm veg/meat mix and whisk (due to volume we use an electric drill and a plaster mixer !!!)

We add one whole egg per dog.

This mix is then left to cool off for a while (the veg will still be hot and gently heats/cooks through the meat and eggs too.

The resultant "porridge" mix is then ladled into dog bowls (each bowl is filled level) and then given to the dogs - it normally takes about an hour to prepare and then 1 minute to eat !!! (as per most Sunday Roasts !) - and then I am left to do the washing up !!

As I mentioned above - this is prepared at least once a month - though new mums can have this once a week - it depends on whether or not they look to eat grass when in their paddock (dogs have a natural ability to adjust their diet if they feel it necessary and eating grass and digging up grass roots is normally a digestive aid).

So a typical month would be - raw carcass every day - except once a month this veg/meat/egg mix (in place of the carcass) - then the following day is a "starve day" (no food at all) then the day after that back to the carcass and so on.

The BARF diet is supposed to replicate a natural diet - what dogs would actually get to eat if running wild (remember it is US who "domesticated" them !).
The veg element would be what they would eat from the stomachs of any prey or carrion they would find - and the starve day also aids with their detox as well as being a true fact of being in the wild (sometimes they would not feed for a few days if pickings were slim !).

...........Natural Instinct (NI) is basically the same in simple pre-packed pre-portioned frozen packs - and Orijen is great for pups - new owners can then make whatever choice they want from then on xx

You can even mix meat with Orijen too if you fancied.

Stephen x


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## JoJo (Mar 2, 2011)

That was a great read ... Thank you so much Stephen ... I am sure this will be most helpful for us all on the forum. Perfectly explained with the pic too, oh you are good .... many thanks JoJo x


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## pixie (Apr 16, 2011)

With 3kids my freezer is always choc full,is it best to have a bulk load of frozen NI or carcases,instead of in my heavily laden fridge? Or should i just stick with Orijen? would really love to follow on your good diet when we pick pup up,just dont know what to do,Simply put i have no room in my freezer and little more in my fridge!!!!
Loved the pics,thanks even though it looks totally disgusting! Maybe i should make a job lot for all the family once a month ;0


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

pixie said:


> With 3kids my freezer is always choc full,is it best to have a bulk load of frozen NI or carcases,instead of in my heavily laden fridge? Or should i just stick with Orijen? would really love to follow on your good diet when we pick pup up,just dont know what to do,Simply put i have no room in my freezer and little more in my fridge!!!!
> Loved the pics,thanks even though it looks totally disgusting! Maybe i should make a job lot for all the family once a month ;0


Hi Becky,

I would think Orijen would be ideal for life if needed - as you can buy either the "Puppy" size AND an "Adult" size too.

I personally haven't tried NI - on our scale it would cost too much - and I'm happier myself to prepare fresh each time.

Stephen x


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

fallon said:


> Looks fab  you know the Origen stephen, is it a plain kibble biscuit or like a muesli mix type of food. X


Hi Sarah,

Orijen "Puppy" is a small dry plain brown kibble - identical in look to Royal Canin Medium Junior 32.

It then has an Adult version - and they are specific colour coded bags dependent on overall dog size / breed.

Stephen xx


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## ali-s.j. (Jun 6, 2011)

As much as I'd love to, I couldn't commit to a BARF diet just now. Would it be ok then to continue to feed Lottie on Orijen mixed with some odd table scraps, or would you recommend using raw meat mixed in, and some bones when she's bigger?


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## curt3007 (May 28, 2011)

Many thanks Stephen, loved the pics and appreciate the time you took to do this. My pup will come having been fed on Royal Canin and I am thinking of swopping him to Origen and then possibly NI. May even go straight to NI, woud appreciate your thoughts.


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

ali-s.j. said:


> As much as I'd love to, I couldn't commit to a BARF diet just now. Would it be ok then to continue to feed Lottie on Orijen mixed with some odd table scraps, or would you recommend using raw meat mixed in, and some bones when she's bigger?


Hi Ali,

Orijen should see you all the way - through pup to adult and beyond !........just up the kibble size to "Adult" from about 7 months old.

I'd personally offer table scraps (meat - chicken) as treats (after your meal) for doing something good (so do some little bit of training such as getting them to - sit / lay down and role over or give you a paw to shake). IF you really want to give veg table scraps - then make sure it does have meat in the mix - or even mix the veg with Orijen if you fancied. 
I'd personally recommend that you keep a staple food such as Orijen for meal times only - anything else should be a bonus. 
Cooked chicken is fine. A bone can be good when older - butchers are normally good to ask - anything too big and they'll never get into it - anything too small just be careful they don't get bones caught in their mouths / throats - it really does come down to common sense.

If I ever get bones - I get big ones as it's fun for the dogs - once they have had their play out of them - I then crack them open with a mallet - and just take out the marrowbone - it makes a great fun outside reward treat (some bones can splinter).

Stephen xx


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

curt3007 said:


> Many thanks Stephen, loved the pics and appreciate the time you took to do this. My pup will come having been fed on Royal Canin and I am thinking of swopping him to Origen and then possibly NI. May even go straight to NI, woud appreciate your thoughts.


Hi Curt3007,

Personally - if you were "thinking" of Royal Canin - then I'd stick with Orijen all the way through to Adulthood (they do an Adult version) - actual feeding regime would be identical.

NI is perhaps a purer form - but a fair bit more effort (and the JD BARF even more so).

From looking into it all - I personally think Orijen ideal for 95% of people - purely down to ease of use.

Stephen x


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## pixie (Apr 16, 2011)

Thanks for the info Stephen,have just found a Orijen supplier in Halesworth which is ideal for me as my stepson lives near,and can stock up on my way to Southwold for Walkies! Is it ok to give the odd chicken carcass aswell as Origen?


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## gemma27 (May 23, 2011)

Hi. Thanks very much Stephen for the very useful and very timely post.

Since visiting you I have been researching BARF and NI with a view to using one or other when we get our new pup from you but also for our existing dog. Our JRT has pancreatitis despite being only 4 years old and of slim build. Ideally I want to be able to have them both on the same diet so am speaking to my vet tonight re BARF for her pancreatitis.

I have already spoken with NI and I think it would be suitable but want to have Jess (JRT) pancreatitis tested again to see how she is now and give the vet a chance to give their view. Will be interesting to see what they say.

Gemma


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

Yes it would be fine to give the odd chicken carcass - though it must be RAW (**** Never feed cooked chicken bones - they can splinter !).

Southwold !!!! - Great Choice ! - I went to School there and played rugby for Southwold Rugby Club for 15+ years ! We actually have a pair of cottages in Wrentham that we are renovating to rent out (whenever we get the time !!!!!).

Stephen x


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## kendal (Jul 16, 2009)

some vets can be dead against raw, my vet isnt particuaraly keen on it but i dont see her that often lol (doesnt that tell you something lol)


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## curt3007 (May 28, 2011)

Used to visit Halesworth alot as a teenager to stop with my mums friends (rector of Halesworth and Southwold)


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## pixie (Apr 16, 2011)

Its a small world!...We are in southwold nearly every other weekend,so its like home to us,i love it and i love looking at all the different dogs being paraded along the promenade!Will be cool to add a cockapoo to them all,i have seen a few there. You lucky things having somewhere near the coast will def be interested in having a romantic break away with the man when you all renovated! Did you go to Saint Felix? I always look at that school and think oh if only i could afford all 3 to go there....fat chance! Looking forward to spending a lazy sunday outside the pub on the green with pup in tow


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

pixie said:


> Its a small world!...We are in southwold nearly every other weekend,so its like home to us,i love it and i love looking at all the different dogs being paraded along the promenade!Will be cool to add a cockapoo to them all,i have seen a few there. You lucky things having somewhere near the coast will def be interested in having a romantic break away with the man when you all renovated! Did you go to Saint Felix? I always look at that school and think oh if only i could afford all 3 to go there....fat chance! Looking forward to spending a lazy sunday outside the pub on the green with pup in tow


WOW - my ex-Wife and her husband have the pharmacy in the High Street. 
When I married Julia we bought my ex-wife out of our cottages (I lived in Wrentham for 18 years - having been born in Kessingland and sent to boarding school in Sounthwold (Eversley School - now no longer there !) - my eldest son attended St Felix for a year - and I actually coached rugby there at the time !
And having been an Antiques Dealer for 20+ years I know all the dealers in that neck of the woods. I'm there as often as possible (as my sons stay with Mum there) and my parents are still in Kessingland.
Stephen x


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## caradunne (Nov 29, 2010)

Lovely pics - looks like a Hong Kong street food market!


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## curt3007 (May 28, 2011)

Looks so good I could eat it myself (well almost)


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## pixie (Apr 16, 2011)

My house is full of a few antiques from around there!,love Walberswick too lovely to walk dogs around the dunes,Funny went to kessingland last week to 'Africa Alive'. Sorry this is going a bit off track!!! seriously though i would love to be able to feed the chicken carcasses,where do you get them from and are they ok in fridge,just get out when needed?The thought of odourless(or as near as) poo is a winner for me,although the monthly doggie colonic clearout sound a bit Brilliant pictures,for a visual learner like me it makes all the difference seeing it


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## Dylansmum (Oct 29, 2010)

gemma27 said:


> Ideally I want to be able to have them both on the same diet so am speaking to my vet tonight re BARF for her pancreatitis.
> 
> I have already spoken with NI and I think it would be suitable but want to have Jess (JRT) pancreatitis tested again to see how she is now and give the vet a chance to give their view. Will be interesting to see what they say.
> 
> Gemma


Hi Gemma, All the vets that I have had vary in their reaction to BARF from totally hostile to biting their lip to avoid telling me what they think of me! One even told me that my dog would die from salmonella! And that dog lived to 17! So don't be surprised if your vet is anti, but try to make up your own mind from the research you are doing. It's like GP's and complementary medicine - they just don't get it as it's outside their remit.


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## gemma27 (May 23, 2011)

Dylansmum said:


> Hi Gemma, All the vets that I have had vary in their reaction to BARF from totally hostile to biting their lip to avoid telling me what they think of me! One even told me that my dog would die from salmonella! And that dog lived to 17! So don't be surprised if your vet is anti, but try to make up your own mind from the research you are doing. It's like GP's and complementary medicine - they just don't get it as it's outside their remit.


Thanks for the advice, we were not expecting a particularly positive response from the vet but I was very pleasantly surprised. The vet was happy to discuss the options and though was not very receptive to us doing BARF ourselves, she was very receptive to the Natural Instinct option. She has not heard of them so has taken their details and is going to contact NI to make sure that the food is okay for Pancreatitis. I have already spoken to NI and they believe that our JRT should be fine on it based on her fat content requirements so hopefully it should be okay.

Will wait for her test results and the vets discussion with NI. 

At the end of the day the decision will be ours but I do trust our vet and value her advice. We had for some long time been seeing a different vet at the same practice and had been told that our JRT Jess just had Gastro upsets from scavenging. We were just very lucky that this other vet happened to be there when we brought her in and that she recognised it to be pancreatitis. As it was Jess spent 3 days in intensive care. 6 months on and we are still not out of the woods but without this vet, we wouldn't have Jess today.

Gemma


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

With the new mums - I am now giving each of them a hard boiled egg in the morning then a whole chicken carcass each too - as well as a whole carcass in the evening - I used to just give them double at night when they had pups previously - but have found that splitting the meals for the new mums works better; they settle better back with their pups and it allows their bodies to process the two individual meals better too - because it helps keep their blood-sugar levels and calcium levels right.

A week before the mums are due - we start with the boiled egg in the morning along with half a chicken with the other half given at night.


I have also started to notice the mums eating more grass when out in their paddock in the morning - it is normally as a digestive aid - but they are being very selective as to what grass and what part they eat - so I have increased the steamed veg mix (inc the boiled eggs and raw eggs) to once a week to see how that goes.

Stephen x


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

Given that I'm now doing the veg mix once a week - I had gone to Tesco and the local Weekly Boston market and bought the basics.

I have just prepared a "JD BARF-Lite" mix:

2 large heads of Broccoli
5 parsnips
4 carrots
2 large cauliflowers (inc the green bits)
1 pack of Tesco "Greens"
10 hard boiled eggs
5 raw eggs
1 pack of Tesco mixed beef

Lightly steamed the veg (..now that was a close spell-check JoJo !!!) - and whisked in the eggs and beef whilst still warm - let cool for 1/2 an hour - bowl'd it up..................................and watched it all vanish in 10 secs when offered to the dogs !! num-num x

Stephen xx


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