# have found one



## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

right, i have been a bit quiet about this, but i REALLY need some advice, have found a 12 wk puppy on a site, he is being sold on as the people who brought him are finding it all too much, as they have a six month old baby, and husband works full time, which i ca nsee would be hard. well they told me yes , the breeder told them he has come from eye tested stock, but they havent seen or got the proof to show me.he is obviously going to be snapped up quite quicly by somebodY not as fussy as me, so what do i do? i really want to take him,some body will for sure, the lady has given me more time to think about it, she sounds l;ovely, HELP!


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## lady amanda (Nov 26, 2010)

Ask for the breeders phone number! they should be open about where they got the dog from....give the breeder a call and ask about all of the testing.


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## lady amanda (Nov 26, 2010)

we didnt know better when we got lady...I didn't know about testing or anything like that at all....she was 12 weeks.


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

She has just messaged me back , saying we sound perfect for him, and that she can assure me they would nt have got him themselves without asking about PRA HELP


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

lady amanda said:


> Ask for the breeders phone number! they should be open about where they got the dog from....give the breeder a call and ask about all of the testing.


i have done that already, she has nt got the details he came from a family home breeder in coventry


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

If it was me I would wait. They haven't have the puppy that long and should still have the contact details for the breeder. I know it is hard but that is my gut reaction.


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

crazy lady said:


> right, i have been a bit quiet about this, but i REALLY need some advice, have found a 12 wk puppy on a site, he is being sold on as the people who brought him are finding it all too much, as they have a six month old baby, and husband works full time, which i ca nsee would be hard. well they told me yes , the breeder told them he has come from eye tested stock, but they havent seen or got the proof to show me.he is obviously going to be snapped up quite quicly by somebodY not as fussy as me, so what do i do? i really want to take him,some body will for sure, the lady has given me more time to think about it, she sounds l;ovely, HELP!


The biggest thing that stands out a mile here is - why haven't the breeder taken the pup back ????????? - the pup is only 12 weeks old !

There is another post just added to about the "eye test" - if it was a BVA test then that is just a spot-check done at a vet's - if they breeder had carried out a PRA DNA test and the result was "Normal/Clear" then they should most certainly be able and willing to confirm it with the relevant paperwork.

As a breeder myself - I would not hesitate to take back any puppy at any age and then look to find them a "forever home".

There are puppies out there and most with more than an acceptable degree to paperwork, checks, health and breeding - so is jumping on this pup a head thing or a heart thing !? 

Whichever way you go - places like this site, The Cockapoo Club of GB and no doubt the Cockapoo Owners Club would be happy to help with advice and support.

Stephen xx


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

I agree, the family rehoming it should go back to the breeder. The problem is though alot don't as they want to try and recoup some of the money they have spent. It is a shame. Even though they might not be legally binding I still think contracts could deter some from selling on.

I know it is tempting when a pup is there and available and it all just might be ok but there are too many alarm bells ringing for my liking. Good luck with your decision.


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## lady amanda (Nov 26, 2010)

but they have no certificate? or a health guarantee? or an origional contract for him. Just ask where they got him, and do a quick bit of research on where they got him.....


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## colpa110 (Jul 5, 2011)

You have received good advice already. I had the same dilemma a while back
when a lady on here was looking to rehome a 5 Month old dog because she
had become allergic to it..she posted some videos of the dog running around on a beach and it was very cute. Unfortunately she could not obtain proof of
eye or health testing from the breeder because they had fallen out. I went to quite a bit of trouble to find the information out independently but without success. In the end I decided I was not prepared to take the risk..and in hindsight i know that to have been the right decision. I think it would be hard
to live with yourself if the dog went blind knowing you had not obtained the relevant testing...I'm sorry if this is not what you wanted to hear.


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

thank you everybody, i came on asking for advice, before i jumped in, and that is what i have got- good solid advice. No i do not want to jump in and regret it later, part of the reason i want to get another dog sooner than later is because our current dog will be 7 very soon , and i dont want her to be much older, as i feel this wont be fair n her, and what i am looking for is proving hard to come by,so if jukee doodles you do get a pup returned PLEASE think of me, i had a look at your website, and really liked what i saw, but you have an almighty waiting list!


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

Have you had a look on www.breedersonline.co.uk? There are often puppies available or you could look in the breeder section and call a few. I am sure other members would also be happy to make suggestions of breeders to call....you never know, there might be some puppies available! 

Good luck in your search.


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## Turi (Jun 28, 2011)

Hi there, 

I hope you don’t mind me saying but I noticed you wrote on your ‘homepage’ that you’d like a slightly older puppy because you feel it would be more fair to leave an older puppy during the day. However, if you buy an older puppy it might have previously lived with a family that was in all day and so the adjustment could be all the more difficult. If you get the school holidays off why don’t you try and find a puppy that is available to coordinate with the next holiday? Then you could be there in the early stages and you could gradually get your puppy used to being by itself. When you return to work I’d organise a dog walker - your working hours aren’t particularly long compared to some of the other full-time workers on here but being by itself for that amount of time may still be too much for a sociable dog like a Cockapoo. 

Good luck and let us know how you get on!


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## MillieDog (Jun 1, 2011)

You're right someone will snap the puppy up. Not everyone is diligent enough to make all the checks. Too many people buy with their heart only and not their head. I do have alarm bells when someone says they can't remember where the got the puppy from. 

You will find the right puppy for you and your circumstances.


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

I totally agree - "now finding the right dog" is certainly better than "finding a dog right now".

We hear all too often "I wish I knew then what I know now" - so I agree - any alarm bell in your head is an alarm bell worth listening to !

If you look at The Cockapoo Club of GB's website (www.cockapooclubgb.co.uk) you will see that we are looking to set-up a list of people happy to re-home or even foster a Cockapoo until it's "Forever Home" can be found. 

Having links now with Wood Green Animal Shelter - we hope to be advised of any Cockapoo made known to them - so by all means join and register an interest.

Stephen xx


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## Pollypiglet (Oct 22, 2011)

BE VERY CAREFUL! Breeding papers conveniently not available should ring alarm bells. If there is nothing to hide all the information should be available. Never buy a dog out of pity some of these health problems do not show themselves until some years down the line. If someone else was going to snap the puppy up you can bet your life the seller would not give you time to think about it. In the end it is up to you, take the risk at your own expense. If you feel you want the pup go ahead but don't let your heart rule your head. (Easy for me to say!)

Also if they are having problems with the puppy are you experienced enough to take those problems on and resolve them?


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

i said no to the pup, hard to do but now done. i will look later on breedersonline, i am thinking maybe easte rnow? we are away two weeks in the summer holidays, so that would be difficult, oh i dont know! my head feels all messed up with it all! but i do thank you all for your help, i do listen to things i am told, now just need to find perfect pup/ older pup!


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

oh and i have registered with the cockapoo club, stating interest in rehoming , would also consider fostering.


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## Pollypiglet (Oct 22, 2011)

Well done you it is hard but if it had been right it would have felt it. There are loads of good puppies out there and yours is waiting for you. The worst case scenario would have been if you had taken the pup then had to move it on. Iam sure it will find a loving home but not you.


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## tessybear (May 1, 2011)

Well I never asked anything from my breeder about tests either! I just trusted her and loved my puppies mothers when I met them.


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## MillieDog (Jun 1, 2011)

crazy lady said:


> i said no to the pup, hard to do but now done. i will look later on breedersonline, i am thinking maybe easte rnow? we are away two weeks in the summer holidays, so that would be difficult, oh i dont know! my head feels all messed up with it all! but i do thank you all for your help, i do listen to things i am told, now just need to find perfect pup/ older pup!


A tough decision, well done 

Dont worry about your summer holiday, the pup will be fine having its own holiday too. Some breeders also offer holiday boarding services too.


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

tessybear said:


> Well I never asked anything from my breeder about tests either! I just trusted her and loved my puppies mothers when I met them.


I think you'll find the majority of owners with dogs two years old and older never asked nor thought about any of the issues that are now common topics......and saying that - there are loads and loads of lovely dogs out there. The "however" part probably stems from the fact that the older dogs out there more than likely came from breeders who had put a bit of thought into the breeding process....not necessarily in actual health testing but more the lines, temperament and character of the parents being used. With the explosion of interest in "Cockapoo" in the last couple of years we have seen the number of breeders shoot from about half a dozen to many (maybe over a hundred) - and it's the potential of indescriminent breeding that has triggered a new drive to ensure an ethical approach and "ethical" encompasses health and welfare of dogs as well as the relevant health testing. 

As the breed "Cockapoo" develops so will any potential health trait and all authorities - such as the ILMC / The Cockapoo Club of GB / the Cockapoo Owners Club and enthusiast's blogs (such as JoJo's "My Dog's Life" / Embee's "Embee's Cockapoos" and The Sharple's "LunaCockapoo") have a duty to make the public aware. At the end of the day there is no substitute for good breeding practices and we all need to ensure Cockapoo on-going is cared for and catered for.

Stephen xx


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## Turi (Jun 28, 2011)

Stephen, do you think the Cockapoo will become a breed in its own right?


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

Turi said:


> Stephen, do you think the Cockapoo will become a breed in its own right?


The definition of a "Breed" is when you have the ability to breed two like parents and the resultant offspring breeds "true to type".

Generally speaking you are looking at many generations before that consistency could run true.

All "pure-breed" Pedigree breeds have at some point had to have been in-bred (or line-bred which is a dilute form of in-breeding) to successfully develop a "type" by selectively breeding in desired traits. It is allegedly the misunderstanding of this line-breeding that has resulted in the issues with so many breeds that have caused the KC to re-think some of their own ethics and practices. In-breeding doesn't cause bad genes - it increases the likelihood of them moving from being hidden behind stronger traits to being present. To eliminate these undesirable traits a responsible breeding program would simply not allow any dog showing the undesirable trait to be bred from as the ones that don't display the trait don't carry the gene. However how many people would be shocked (including me) when Rhodesian Ridgebacks, for example, who's puppies were culled if they didn't display the "ridge" ? 
Are then breeders prepared to be that ruthless to strive towards being able to breed "true to type" ? 
Are the public, now so much more aware and conscious of breeding practices, prepared to push for it too ??

If you look at the current gene-pool for the Cockapoo - you'll perhaps find that is it currently still to small to go much past F5 / F6 without risk of common ancestry - so the CCGB's Register is there to help with linage paperwork.

"Cockapoo" does have a disadvantage in that there are several options available when you take into account of the types of parentage used - and then the 'b" versions when bred-back to any of the core breeds.

Do Cockapoos exist even if they are not classed as a breed - YES !
Do they need to be classed as a breed ??? - Only if you want to "Show" them within the current regulations of the KC !

Personally it does not matter to me - I have loved them, I do love them and I will love them - breed or not !

Stephen xx


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## Turi (Jun 28, 2011)

Puppies were culled in order to produce a standard? I never knew that. 

If the only way to make a Cockapoo conform to standard recognised by the KC is this kind of breeding then it doesn’t interest me in the slightest. 

This is all really informative and interesting… and perfect ammunition if we’re approached by purists when out walking our Cockapoo. We’ve already had a few snooty looks when we tell people what we’re getting!


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## lady amanda (Nov 26, 2010)

Let them be Snooty Turi! we can keep the wonderful cockapoo as our secret!


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## JoJo (Mar 2, 2011)

ha ha ha .. let them be snooty .. a dog is for loving and enjoying in my opinion and I certainly do that with my wonderful cockapoos ... Lets face it they are great


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

Turi said:


> Puppies were culled in order to produce a standard? I never knew that.
> 
> If the only way to make a Cockapoo conform to standard recognised by the KC is this kind of breeding then it doesn’t interest me in the slightest.
> 
> This is all really informative and interesting… and perfect ammunition if we’re approached by purists when out walking our Cockapoo. We’ve already had a few snooty looks when we tell people what we’re getting!



Hi Turi,

Within the bubble that has been the "Show World" and "Pedigree World" from the KC side of things - many a puppy may have been "culled" not to produce a Standard - but because they did not meet the Standard !!! 
When you are talking about serious breeding to Show Standard within Pedigree Breeds there is sooooo much that went on that "Joe Public" would not agree to / tolerate nor understand - and as such these breeders and their breeding practices operated "behind closed doors" - it is still true today and it even encroaches into the world of Cockapoo - sadly.

Because of this thread - I am working on a new post.

Some KC recognised breeders of pedigree dogs would have gone to great lengths to ensure puppies that they had produced (given that they were in the heady heights of the Elite Show World) were never linked back to them - I heard many a tale and with serious research I am working on a piece that will ask some very big questions of where people serious expect and want "Cockapoo" to be heading in the foreseeable future. It should also give you more than enough "ammunition" to blast any "dog snob" out of the water if they dared pass comment. x

As I have mentioned before in this post - "Ethical" breeding is not all centred on Health Testing issues - it also encompasses the Health and Wellbeing of the "variety" (as technically Cockapoo is not recognised as a "breed").

Stephen x


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