# Latest Cockapoo myth!



## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

Ok, last time it was that a Cockapoo must have a Poodle dad not mum or else it will moult and must be from working Cocker as all show Cockers suffer from Cocker Rage! 

Tonight's special myth as advertised by 'anon breeder' is that F2s are softer nature and more intelligent than F1s!  :laugh: How does that happen I would love to know? What happens when you get to F3 and F4 they must be super dogs who undertake spy missions for MI6? 

Whatever next I wonder? I really shouldn't keep looking I come away amazed everytime at the rubbish that people spout! 

Not going to spoil my mood though


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## Laura(L)Izzie (Sep 9, 2011)

I know, it's all a load of rubbish! People just make things up as they go along I reckon, temperment largely depends on how the dogs are brought up, as for intelligence, cockapoos get that from the poodles, and with f2s you get get more cocker than poodle in the mix, it isn't guaranteed 50/50 or more poodle at all, therefore it cannot be a fact LOL  I wouldn't worry about it, they don't know what they're talking about.


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

LOL - I totally agree - most adverts / sites must be taken with a slight pinch of salt - so to speak !

Why do sellers need to spout such BS to try and sell their pups to intelligent adults !!!???

I personally can't understand - "Top Breeders" of Cockapoos - nor those that state that their Cockapoos "Don't Moult" !!!.

....(just like Poodles - Cockapoos DO moult - they are just low shedding xxx).


Stephen xx


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## M&M's mummy (Jul 12, 2011)

You can drive yourself nuts looking at those type of adverts- they are almost as bad as the ones that are wanting to re-home for stupid reasons.

Never forgot a thread on another forum where somebody who works in a rescue was fuming because a dog had been handed in because it didn't match the colour of their new carpet


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

Seriously? I can't believe someone would do that! Mind you I only got Daisy because she matched the cat!   










Daisy looks a bit sad here, it's because despite bouncing around for 20 minutes barking her head off Milly the cat still didn't want to play with her


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## wellerfeller (Jul 12, 2011)

Sezra said:


> Ok, last time it was that a Cockapoo must have a Poodle dad not mum or else it will moult and must be from working Cocker as all show Cockers suffer from Cocker Rage!
> 
> Tonight's special myth as advertised by 'anon breeder' is that F2s are softer nature and more intelligent than F1s!  :laugh: How does that happen I would love to know? What happens when you get to F3 and F4 they must be super dogs who undertake spy missions for MI6?
> 
> ...


This is true Sarah..............have you not seen Cats and Dogs, The Revenge Of Kitty Galore!!!!!!!!!!!!!
There are some idiots out there, they obviously just trying to make their dogs sound that much more attractive, to people who wouldn't know what utter BS it is! x


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## M&M's mummy (Jul 12, 2011)

awww Milly looks just like Cheeky:cry2::cry2:


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## Guest (Sep 27, 2011)

*wrong*



Laura(L)Izzie said:


> I know, it's all a load of rubbish! People just make things up as they go along I reckon, temperment largely depends on how the dogs are brought up, as for intelligence, cockapoos get that from the poodles, and with f2s you get get more cocker than poodle in the mix, it isn't guaranteed 50/50 or more poodle at all, therefore it cannot be a fact LOL  I wouldn't worry about it, they don't know what they're talking about.



laura you have that wrong i breed f2 and f3 and so far they have come out 50/50 you have to breed and experience these things for your self before people should comment , as for temperament it is partly how a dog is reared but also the bloodlines and temperament of the parents , that is why breeding adults should be assest individually on there merit, most people just mate any old cocker to joe blogs poodle down the road and wonder why the puppies are biting and growling at an early age if it is bred in them they will be aggresive as adults ...example rottweilers in the 70s and 80s were wonderful gentle soft couch potatoes then in the 90s certain breeders imported germanic dogs in with high powered attitude and temperaments ...and it all went down hill we had rotties attacking children and adults in the news ...it went the same way with german shepherds and still is , dogs that are aggresive nervous and unpredictable we fortunatly are now going back to the soft gentle rottweiler of the 70s and 80s due to caring conserned breeders in the uk ...wow did i do a jd rant ??? janice xxx


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## Laura(L)Izzie (Sep 9, 2011)

I didn't actually say that you don't get a 50/50 mix with f2s, I was just stating that because they have 50/50 in each parent you're not GUARANTEED a 50/50 mix, which means there is a possibility for more cocker/poodle in the pups, I know i'm not an expert and I don't have the experience, i'm just stating that you can't guarantee anything because of how they're bred. I don't there you needed to be so blunt saying I can't comment because I don't have the experience when I was giving an opinion :S


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

romeo said:


> laura you have that wrong i breed f2 and f3 and so far they have come out 50/50 you have to breed and experience these things for your self before people should comment , as for temperament it is partly how a dog is reared but also the bloodlines and temperament of the parents , that is why breeding adults should be assest individually on there merit, most people just mate any old cocker to joe blogs poodle down the road and wonder why the puppies are biting and growling at an early age if it is bred in them they will be aggresive as adults ...example rottweilers in the 70s and 80s were wonderful gentle soft couch potatoes then in the 90s certain breeders imported germanic dogs in with high powered attitude and temperaments ...and it all went down hill we had rotties attacking children and adults in the news ...it went the same way with german shepherds and still is , dogs that are aggresive nervous and unpredictable we fortunatly are now going back to the soft gentle rottweiler of the 70s and 80s due to caring conserned breeders in the uk ...wow did i do a jd rant ??? janice xxx



Spot on Janice...........yep you did do a JD rant 

I'm with you about people reading theory then 'cutting and pasting' it and offering it as advice to others. I respect those who talk about their hard earned real life experiences. Julia xxx


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## Guest (Sep 27, 2011)

sorry laura just stating what you said


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

M&M's mummy said:


> awww Milly looks just like Cheeky:cry2::cry2:


I know, I have often thought that! Sorry if the photo made you sad. :hug:


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## M&M's mummy (Jul 12, 2011)

Sezra said:


> I know, I have often thought that! Sorry if the photo made you sad. :hug:


It's ok hun- the amount of black cats you see anyway.

Milly is lovely as is Daisy- I have always liked black coats on animals.


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

Laura(L)Izzie said:


> I didn't actually say that you don't get a 50/50 mix with f2s, I was just stating that because they have 50/50 in each parent you're not GUARANTEED a 50/50 mix, which means there is a possibility for more cocker/poodle in the pups, I know i'm not an expert and I don't have the experience, i'm just stating that you can't guarantee anything because of how they're bred. I don't there you needed to be so blunt saying I can't comment because I don't have the experience when I was giving an opinion :S


Don't worry Laura,the gentics of dog breeding is complicated and I am not even going to pretend to know anything about it!  Maybe you were thinking about the Cocker being more prevalent due to sometimes getting Cocker looking throwbacks in F2 litters? Anyway, It is more than looking at just the parents. Traits, illnesses, colours etc can also be inherited from grandparents. Breeding dogs is a much more complex issue than I ever could have imagined and is not something to be taken on lightly, especially if you want to do it well!  

There is nothing wrong with doing your research though and learning, we all start somewhere and most of us still have alot more to learn!  x


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## M&M's mummy (Jul 12, 2011)

Sezra said:


> Don't worry Laura,the gentics of dog breeding is complicated and I am not even going to pretend to know anything about it!  Maybe you were thinking about the Cocker being more prevalent due to sometimes getting Cocker looking throwbacks in F2 litters? Anyway, It is more than looking at just the parents. Traits, illnesses, colours etc can also be inherited from grandparents. Breeding dogs is a much more complex issue than I ever could have imagined and is not something to be taken on lightly, especially if you want to do it well!
> 
> There is nothing wrong with doing your research though and learning, we all start somewhere and most of us still have alot more to learn!  x


Yes we have read some stuff in our time haven't we hun?

Genetics is a minefield!! 

I have looked into it and it made me crazy  I had alleles and phenotypes and genotpes etc... whizzing about my head 

Laura what you may be thinking of is something called " The grandfather effect" which happens in F2's as they have a higher incidence of the pups resembling more of one of their parents breeds.


With reference to Julia's comments whilst breeders have "hands on " experience I think it is a little unfair to dismiss peoples comments because they don't breed, especially those who have an avid interest in research and study and fact-finding etc......

Some of us also learn from other breeders from a cross section of breeders and I think forums are great place for people to share knowledge and help and advice.

Believe me both Sezra and I have heard some BS coming from breeders who supposedly should know better, so I personally don't think that all breeders know all the answers, and learning is an ongoing process.


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## JoJo (Mar 2, 2011)

Research before breeding is highly important ... whatever breed you are breeding.. we are only human but learning is so important ... 

Anyone can breed.. but not everyone can do it well .. that is why you get poor adverts out there .. and some experienced breeders have learnt and do it well, but some dont... that is just the way it is ...


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

M&M's mummy said:


> With reference to Julia's comments whilst breeders have "hands on " experience I think it is a little unfair to dismiss peoples comments because they don't breed, especially those who have an avid interest in research and study and fact-finding etc......
> 
> Some of us also learn from other breeders from a cross section of breeders and I think forums are great place for people to share knowledge and help and advice.
> 
> Believe me both Sezra and I have heard some BS coming from breeders who supposedly should know better, so I personally don't think that all breeders know all the answers, and learning is an ongoing process.


My comments are not unfair at all.....that's how I feel. I perhaps should have quantified that I only respect people who have knowledge AND experience in breeding as they should go hand in hand. Yes there are people who breed without any understanding of what or why they are doing it. Equally there are people who have learned lots of theory, which is great good on them, but my beef is when they then offer that theory as advice to others without any experience to give them a real depth of understanding. I'm sorry if others don't like this opinion but it's one that I own. Julia x


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## JoJo (Mar 2, 2011)

Regarding the outcome of litters F1, F2 litters .. now I have been looking into this and guess what I have experience of this too, seen the birth and followed the pups, plus observed a selection of litters .... throwbacks or pups looking more poodle or more cocker are possible in all litters ... I agree with Janice .. I liked your rant  ... an F2 litter can have a 50:50 outcome .. or have throwbacks .. also throwback are just a cute a 50:50 mix.. 

I just wish all breeders were good then we wouldn't ever have these conversations  but they aren't


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

Having the expertise in your area of breeding and the experience is the ideal option, sadly there are not many that seem to have both.  

Despite this, a fact is a fact and you do not have to have bred dogs to be able to learn about disease inheritance or genetics and be able to relay this information. That is like saying that JoJo should not be able to offer advice on her blog when she has researched incredibly carefully or that I cannot discuss PRA inheritance on a thread when people get their information wrong. I don't have to have experienced breeding a dog with PRA to understand how it is carried.  

We all offer each other advice on here about Cockapoos and we are all learning along the way but that does not mean we should not be able to offer advice to each other. It might be something we have experienced or it might be something we have read, it doesn't make it any less valuable if it from a reliable source.

I only started this thread as a bit of fun as I can't believe what some breeders write in their sales pitch, it is a shame that it has taken this turn. 

I liked the idea of Cockapoo spy dogs!  :spy:


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## wellerfeller (Jul 12, 2011)

Me too Sarah!!!! I love that film, Cats and dogs (secretly) as one of the characters, I think he is called Butch, is an Anatolian shepherd and I used to have those, beautiful, huge and so loyal. Love them


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## M&M's mummy (Jul 12, 2011)

Jukee Doodles said:


> My comments are not unfair at all.....that's how I feel. I perhaps should have quantified that I only respect people who have knowledge AND experience in breeding as they should go hand in hand. Yes there are people who breed without any understanding of what or why they are doing it. Equally there are people who have learned lots of theory, which is great good on them, but my beef is when they then offer that theory as advice to others without any experience to give them a real depth of understanding. I'm sorry if others don't like this opinion but it's one that I own. Julia x


Your comments were unfair in that you have accused people of " cutting and pasting" their theories and offering that as advice.

How do you know where people have gained their knowledge? it isn't right to make assumptions about members on here without knowing the full facts IMO.

Yes of course you are entitled to your opinions just as I and Laura am- but I didn't think your statement was warranted on this thread.


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## Laura(L)Izzie (Sep 9, 2011)

Yes it is a shame, because I have only said what I thought was true than not all cockapoos bred with 2 F1 cockapoos will end up with a 50/50 mix, i'm not saying that's always the case, it may only be sometimes, I just didn't think that comment was very fair and I should've been told not to say anything, breeders obviously have experience & I don't but it shouldn't mean I can't write anything about it, but whatever if people don't want me to comment, I won't bother with breeding posts in future if only breeders can give opinions & experiences  & thanks for those who make nice comments to be about throwbacks and didn't just say you're wrong! enjoy.


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

Laura(L)Izzie said:


> Yes it is a shame, because I have only said what I thought was true than not all cockapoos bred with 2 F1 cockapoos will end up with a 50/50 mix, i'm not saying that's always the case, it may only be sometimes, I just didn't think that comment was very fair and I should've been told not to say anything, breeders obviously have experience & I don't but it shouldn't mean I can't write anything about it, but whatever if people don't want me to comment, I won't bother with breeding posts in future if only breeders can give opinions & experiences  & thanks for those who make nice comments to be about throwbacks and didn't just say you're wrong! enjoy.


Laura please don't be put off commenting anywhere on this forum.  I can understand how you feel as I have experienced this on forums myself. I had no idea what I was looking for when I researched getting a Cockapoo and my opinions changed along the way as I learnt about ethical breeding, health testing etc. It is a whole different world and I have only just scratched the surface of it myself! 

A forum is a fabulous place to learn and their are lots of lovely people on here who are happy to share their experiences and advice with each other. Please don't be put off. xxx


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## wellerfeller (Jul 12, 2011)

Laura(L)Izzie said:


> Yes it is a shame, because I have only said what I thought was true than not all cockapoos bred with 2 F1 cockapoos will end up with a 50/50 mix, i'm not saying that's always the case, it may only be sometimes, I just didn't think that comment was very fair and I should've been told not to say anything, breeders obviously have experience & I don't but it shouldn't mean I can't write anything about it, but whatever if people don't want me to comment, I won't bother with breeding posts in future if only breeders can give opinions & experiences  & thanks for those who make nice comments to be about throwbacks and didn't just say you're wrong! enjoy.


Laura this was in fact a thread about breeders advertising not breeding so you have as much right to comment as anyone about it. Comment when and if you want!!!! Genetics, rights and wrongs of breeding etc.....this lot can argue for days about it


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## Laura(L)Izzie (Sep 9, 2011)

Thanks for being really nice  I just didn't think there was evidence for a definite 50/50 kind of mix so that's all I stated & it was mainly commenting on the intelligence part anyway that the Poodle part carries the most intelligence and if there was more Poodle F2s could be smarter, but if more cocker I would have thought F1s probably would have been, it was open to interpretation but not just 'wrong' :| Never mind anyway, opinions, experience, i'm not bothered, I just love my pup so i'll stick to what I know  xx


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## JoJo (Mar 2, 2011)

Laura(L)Izzie said:


> Yes it is a shame, because I have only said what I thought was true than not all cockapoos bred with 2 F1 cockapoos will end up with a 50/50 mix, i'm not saying that's always the case, it may only be sometimes, I just didn't think that comment was very fair and I should've been told not to say anything, breeders obviously have experience & I don't but it shouldn't mean I can't write anything about it, but whatever if people don't want me to comment, I won't bother with breeding posts in future if only breeders can give opinions & experiences  & thanks for those who make nice comments to be about throwbacks and didn't just say you're wrong! enjoy.


Laura you are welcome on here as much as the next person .. this isnt a breeders forum or a puppy selling forum .. it is a cockapoo forum for chatting cockapoo and all are welcome.... some know more than others and that is just life .. you will learn form reading on many thread on here .. not even breeders see eye to eye on many topics .. please don't take any of this to heart ... and actually you had a good point you can get throwbacks in any mix ...


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## M&M's mummy (Jul 12, 2011)

Laura(L)Izzie said:


> Thanks for being really nice  I just didn't think there was evidence for a definite 50/50 kind of mix so that's all I stated & it was mainly commenting on the intelligence part anyway that the Poodle part carries the most intelligence and if there was more Poodle F2s could be smarter, but if more cocker I would have thought F1s probably would have been, it was open to interpretation but not just 'wrong' :| Never mind anyway, opinions, experience, i'm not bothered, I just love my pup so i'll stick to what I know  xx


 You know I keep hearing about poodle intelligence- I think they rank about no 2 but often hubby and I say Monty must not have inherited much from his poodle dad 


aww wicked mummy- do love him though


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## Laura(L)Izzie (Sep 9, 2011)

Haha, why's that? 
Izzie seems really smart, so maybe she recieved a bit too much?!
She had run out of water one day & we hadn't realised (she obviously wanted a drink), so while we were sat watching tv she started making a noise in the kitchen, turns out she was banging her water bowl on her food bowl to get out attention so that we'd come in & fill it up for her!
Another time (she always follows us to the downstairs toiel when we go in and much realise what it's for), we'd forgotten to let her out for a wee before we went out for a meal (miscommunication in the house), and when I got home there was a little puddle on the floor of the downstairs toilet!
Very smart dog  Bless her, a bit annoying though when she out smarts us


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## JoJo (Mar 2, 2011)

Sezra said:


> Having the expertise in your area of breeding and the experience is the ideal option, sadly there are not many that seem to have both.
> 
> Despite this, a fact is a fact and you do not have to have bred dogs to be able to learn about disease inheritance or genetics and be able to relay this information. That is like saying that JoJo should not be able to offer advice on her blog when she has researched incredibly carefully or that I cannot discuss PRA inheritance on a thread when people get their information wrong. I don't have to have experienced breeding a dog with PRA to understand how it is carried.
> 
> ...


... Julia wouldn't be having a bash at me in anyway or form .. I stand for good breeding, yes I research but with that research comes knowledge, information and a little hands on experience too .. all good  and all useful for me and anyone interested ... 

I think all breeder would agree ... its all about balance ... you need it all.


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## Jukee Doodles (Apr 5, 2011)

I don't know why Laura has taken any of my comments personally I wasn't even directing them at her posts. If you are offended Laura I'm sorry. However I'm am just as entitled to my opinion girls and I stick to it. Julia x


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## Laura(L)Izzie (Sep 9, 2011)

Not your comment at all, it was the first one from Janice that seemed very personal and mean, & that was aimed at me, so no Julia not a problem with your posts at all, sorry you thought that x


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

JoJo said:


> ... Julia wouldn't be having a bash at me in anyway or form .. I stand for good breeding, yes I research but with that research comes knowledge, information and a little hands on experience too .. all good  and all useful for me and anyone interested ...
> 
> I think all breeder would agree ... its all about balance ... you need it all.


JoJo, I wasn't saying she was having a bash at you  I was just using you as an example of someone who had not yet bred a litter but was spending a lot of time researching and investigating, and I think that is a very positive thing.  I apologise for using you as an example. 

I really don't know why a thread about the silly things that some breeders say about Cockapoos should turn out this way. The comments have been completely unnessecary and have spoiled the thread.


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## JoJo (Mar 2, 2011)

Agreed ...  

Use me as an example I don't mind ..


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