# Is this a sign?



## DONNA (Jan 7, 2011)

I know people have said wait nearer 10months before taking your pup to have the snip but Buddy has taken to weeing up everything (my bedroom curtains,the stairs etc)
Is this a sign I should think about getting him done earlier then planned? Does anyone else's male puppy do this?


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## Bertie Brown (Aug 12, 2011)

How old is your gorgeous boy now? My Bertie is 16 months and he's an entire male and, touch wood, hasn't ever marked indoors, I guess it depends on the dog. Sorry no help I know!


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## Pollypiglet (Oct 22, 2011)

My cairn puppy had the snip as soon as the "offending articles" appeared at around 6 months my vet said the sooner the better.


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## curt3007 (May 28, 2011)

George is booked for his op on 21st , my vet also said the sooner the better x


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## michaelwatson54 (Jun 24, 2011)

Milo & Alfie have not done any marking indoors although they do mark each other and any other dog outside..... initially our idea was to have them done around 6 months however, after a chat with our breeder's (Julia) we have taken her advice and we will not now have it done until they are at least 10/12 month's.

I want them fully grown and mature before we take the decision any behavioural problems I will try to deal with as and when they arise. 

I'm not in a rush to do this and I have to say I don't exactly like the majority of vet's approach ie 'the sooner the better' 

Mick


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## Kirsty (Sep 9, 2011)

Try dominance, it sounds like he's marking his territory and trying it on. My experience is with GSDs which can be very dominant and Zeus even stood and wee'd in front of me ... He did not do it again ... I had been told to expect the defiance and get ready and take hold of his rough (loose skin on his neck above shoulders) just like his real doggy mam would do if he miss behaved. He never did it again. Xx


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## michaelwatson54 (Jun 24, 2011)

Kirsty said:


> Try dominance, it sounds like he's marking his territory and trying it on. My experience is with GSDs which can be very dominant and Zeus even stood and wee'd in front of me ... He did not do it again ... I had been told to expect the defiance and get ready and take hold of his rough (loose skin on his neck above shoulders) just like his real doggy mam would do if he miss behaved. He never did it again. Xx


Hi Kirsty

I can count the RAF Police dog's (GSD's) on one hand that I came across that had been castrated. Yes you would get the odd Alpha Male who would try to dominate his handler and I have to say had we grabbed them by the scruff of the neck we may well have been on the receiving end of a very nasty situation

I really think today's training methods have moved on to the more Positive Reinforcement Methods and thankfully so......I know Buddy and I think to employ the grab, shake and dominate would be way to hard and this would be counter productive with this still immature puppy. 

The last thing we want is Buddy shying away from his owners every time they go to put their hands on him 

Mick


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## Georgiapeach (Feb 12, 2011)

I got my poodle (neutered) from a rescue group, and my friend, the director of this group, warned me that Potsie marked when she first got him. She put a belly band on him, and he stopped in a couple of days. Sure enough, he started that nonsense when he got to my house. I quickly bought a belly band, and he stopped within a few days. 

Here's a link in case you're not familiar with belly bands: http://www.amazon.com/Simple-Solution-Washable-Male-Medium/dp/B000FJD5ZS/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1323482653&sr=8-1. I put a female pad in it to line it, which is disposable.


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## Kirsty (Sep 9, 2011)

michaelwatson54 said:


> Hi Kirsty
> 
> I can count the RAF Police dog's (GSD's) on one hand that I came across that had been castrated. Yes you would get the odd Alpha Male who would try to dominate his handler and I have to say had we grabbed them by the scruff of the neck we may well have been on the receiving end of a very nasty situation
> 
> ...


Please don't get the wrong impression. I never said anything about shaking, i have never done that and never would. Just a hold and a firm no helped me in that particular situation and it had no negative impact on my ability to touch him, he was a snuggler right to the end. X


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## Kirsty (Sep 9, 2011)

michaelwatson54 said:


> Hi Kirsty
> 
> I can count the RAF Police dog's (GSD's) on one hand that I came across that had been castrated. Yes you would get the odd Alpha Male who would try to dominate his handler and I have to say had we grabbed them by the scruff of the neck we may well have been on the receiving end of a very nasty situation
> 
> ...


Please don't get the wrong impression. I never said anything about shaking. I never have and never will do that. Just a hold and a firm no helped me in that particular situation. It did not have a negative impact for me in terms of touching and handling Zeus, he was a snuggler right to the end. X


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## greenflower (Sep 7, 2011)

michaelwatson54 said:


> Milo & Alfie have not done any marking indoors although they do mark each other and any other dog outside..... initially our idea was to have them done around 6 months however, after a chat with our breeder's (Julia) we have taken her advice and we will not now have it done until they are at least 10/12 month's.
> 
> I want them fully grown and mature before we take the decision any behavioural problems I will try to deal with as and when they arise.
> 
> ...


hi michael
i asked the vet nurse at the puppy party the other night about removing RocketDogs plums (cant spell the "n" word). she was advocating the 6 months but didnt give information on the pros of leaving it later or why they say 6 months. can you tell me the pros and cons please and what the GDA means (not sure i have the initials right either).

thanks Lucy


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## michaelwatson54 (Jun 24, 2011)

Hi Lucy

I will answer your question's but a bit later off now to defrost my dog school

Mick


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

I am sure Mick wont mind be giving you something to read whilst he defrosts his dog school!

http://www.naiaonline.org/pdfs/longtermhealtheffectsofspayneuterindogs.pdf

You don't have to read it all although it is very interesting, there is a summary on page 2 that lists the postitives/negatives of spaying early.

I find that the vets state the reduced risk of testicular cancer as a reason to neuter but they never state how small that risk is (its is tiny). I was going to say more but have decided to put the info in the thread instead! ............

On balance, it appears that no compelling case can be made for neutering most male dogs, especially
immature male dogs, in order to prevent future health problems. The number of health problems associated
with neutering may exceed the associated health benefits in most cases.

*On the positive side, neutering male dogs*

• eliminates the small risk (probably <1%) of dying from testicular cancer
• reduces the risk of non-cancerous prostate disorders
• reduces the risk of perianal fistulas
• may possibly reduce the risk of diabetes (data inconclusive)

*On the negative side, neutering male dogs*

• if done before 1 year of age, significantly increases the risk of osteosarcoma (bone cancer); this is a
common cancer in medium/large and larger breeds with a poor prognosis.
• increases the risk of cardiac hemangiosarcoma by a factor of 1.6
• triples the risk of hypothyroidism
• increases the risk of progressive geriatric cognitive impairment
• triples the risk of obesity, a common health problem in dogs with many associated health problems
• quadruples the small risk (<0.6%) of prostate cancer
• doubles the small risk (<1%) of urinary tract cancers
• increases the risk of orthopedic disorders
• increases the risk of adverse reactions to vaccinations

Hope this helps and apologies Mick for answering your post, hope you don't mind. xx


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## Dylansmum (Oct 29, 2010)

I had Dylan castrated at 8 months. He was not displaying any behaviour problems at all but I believe that a neutered male is far less likely to be on the receiving end of aggression from other males and as he was badly attacked at 4 months, this has always been a paramount consideration for me. I also know others who have not intended to neuter but have had to later on due to behaviour issues. Personally I find that intact males I come across often have dominance issues towards other dogs and I am definitely on the side of neutering. Most vets still seem to advise early neutering, but from what I have read since, I would go for 8-10 months if I had the decision to make now. Good luck in your decision.


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## DONNA (Jan 7, 2011)

Thanks guys I will see how he goes and think about it again in Jan,so far my hall carpet has been weed on everywhere! My £500 bedroom curtains and my bathroom door,oh well.Also came down to a big rip in my chair in the kitchen the other day when I left the kids in charge for half an hour! This is going to be an expensive Xmas so far!


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

There are things you might want to consider....

Have there been any changes recently..a visiting dog? Being left for longer? Or anything to make Buddy anxious? I am not saying Buddy is stressed but it is listed as a possible cause. 
Sometimes it could be a sign of a urinary tract infection?
Or it is his hormones and he is marking.... ?

Not sure Donna but as I knew nothing I started to look up what an owner would do in this situation. The advice I have found if it is not a medical issue is to reinforce the toilet training outside with high value treats and restrict the dogs area (not let upstairs etc) and when you catch them marking distract them immediately and reward them for stopping. Use a command to distract 'sit' or 'come'.

Maybe Mick will have some training ideas that might help aswell. I do feel for you with your lovely carpets and curtains being weed on. Good luck. xx


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## DONNA (Jan 7, 2011)

only thing that's been different Is I've been ill and unable to take him for a walk,so he's been in the garden a lot.I've never caught him doing it just seen the evidence after,mind you the other day I left my bedroom door open I was in the en suite and he raced in and went through to our bedroom I got him out within minutes and he'd pooed on the floor! iM sure he was laughing at me the cheeky Minx!


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

Sorry to hear you have been poorly. I am no expert (by any stretch of the imagination!  ) but you never know, maybe being ill had some kind of effect?? No idea!

However...about the same age that Buddy is Daisy went through a stage of rushing upstairs and weeing or pooing on my daughters bedroom floor! Naughty Daisy and poor Lizzie who was most upset to be singled out in this way! We wondered if it was because we don't allow her upstairs so she was marking as being one of her areas? Even now though when she goes upstairs I am like a maniac rushing after her as I really don't want to have to clear up more wee or poo from the cream carpet!

I am sure it will just be a phase Donna but I am keeping my fingers crossed for you. xx


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## michaelwatson54 (Jun 24, 2011)

greenflower said:


> hi michael
> i asked the vet nurse at the puppy party the other night about removing RocketDogs plums (cant spell the "n" word). she was advocating the 6 months but didnt give information on the pros of leaving it later or why they say 6 months. can you tell me the pros and cons please and what the GDA means (not sure i have the initials right either).
> 
> thanks Lucy



Hi Lucy

Well I think you've got some great answer's to your questions as for GDA I'm not quite sure what your referring to  maybe I'm confused perhaps someone else may know the meaning of GDA 

Mick


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## flounder_1 (May 12, 2011)

I think Lucy means GSD - German Shepherd Dog? Maybe?


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## michaelwatson54 (Jun 24, 2011)

Hi Donna

When he's weeing indoor's is it a puddle ie is he empting his bladder or is it just a drop?

If he is continually empting his bladder then this is not what I would consider as 'marking'. 

Marking to me is a quick **** of the leg a few drops and move on, normally proceeded by inquisitive sniffing and a more dominant body language.

When he's left his little present for you is it dark in colour and does it have a strong odour?

It may be simply down to the fact you have not been able to get him out as much due to your illness....Alfie and Milo rarely go in the back garden now and require a quick trip around the block where they come across other smells and within a 10 minute walk their bladder's are well and truly empty

Buddy should have good bladder control now and should be able to go for longer periods and if this is not happening he may well have picked up a bladder or urine infection. 

Have you noticed him trying to wee and nothing coming...another sign that he may have a problem with his water works....

Mick


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

Great Dane Adoption???
Guide dogs of America??

 I don't know...


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## greenflower (Sep 7, 2011)

hi all

sorry for the late response - i have a little distraction.......

the GSDs made me laugh. i did get the initials wrong and i guess it was German Shepard Dogs. i think i did an ohhhhhh followed by a Doh!

the information on nutering was very interesting (thanks Sarah). it seems there are several dog related matters that vets seem to have a different opinion on such as NI. being new to dogs (puppy) everything is a learning curve for me. visits so far to the vets have been fairly brief with minimal time to have a constructive conversation on some of these topics (plus i find it difficult to concentrate with my little distraction). it does make me appriciate the forum even more as it is such a responsive way to get information. i have to say i think the forum has added to the quality of my experience with RocketDog. when i next have the conversation with the vet about nutering ill add some of information sarah.

thanks everyone X


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## DONNA (Jan 7, 2011)

Buddy has fantastic bladder control Mick and has dOne even from 8weeks,that's why I thought it was marking.I've never seen him do it so. I'm not sure how much was there as its soaked in.
I did give him lots of wee breaks in the garden and I do watch to make sure he goes which he does I'm hopeing it's just because his routine was different last week .
Sarah your right about the upstairs thing we always keep the doors shut and he's not allowed in so when he does get in on the odd occasion maybe he is marking,we have a cream carpet. Up there also hence reason he's not allowed in there.
I'm still Ill but hope to get back to doing some short Walks next week hopefully he'll stop doing it then.


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## michaelwatson54 (Jun 24, 2011)

Hi Donna
Hope your feeling much better I think we can say he's probably not got any water work problems

Hopefully it is just that his routine has been changed a bit and that once you can get out and about again it will stop

I have to say only yesterday Alfie pee'd in the Kitchen we had been for a good walk and they had got absolutely filthy so when we got back I bathed both of them and after their normal loony period they settled as did we feet up and neither of us noticed Alf go to the back door......next thing he walked in gave us a look a Pee'd

So your not alone and I'm sure our dog's will have the odd accident part of being a dog owner I'm afraid

I have to say also if they do manage to get up stairs it look's like a bomb site in 5 minutes

Don't you just love them

Merry Christmas

Mick


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

We had a one year old un neutered dog stay with us at the weekend. He cocked his leg inside when Daisy was sat in his bed! I think the poor fella was probably feeling out of sorts in the new environment and then his only familiar thing had been 'claimed' by my little madam! It was the only accident and it was lovely having a second dog. Daisy was worn out after from the constant playing!


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