# Anti-designer dogs



## greengrapes (Dec 21, 2011)

I'm sorry if this topic has been addressed before, but I am confused with the comments of some people I've talked to about getting a cockapoo.
I like to do my homework before getting anything new and a new puppy is no exception. I've spoken to lots of people about getting a dog and everyone has there opinion about which breeds are best - fair enough.
When we decided to get a poodle cross (because of my daughter's allergies) I have been surprised by the number of comments I've had about them being a "Trendy Designer Dog" asking why I'm paying so much money for a mongrel and why don't we get a rescue dog?
My response with regards to getting a rescue dog has been that I'd like to know the dog's history and make sure that I don't get a dog with any issues. On the cost, surely the cost to raise a litter of puppies is similar whether it's a pedigree or not.

I assume others have had these discussions too and would be pleased to hear what's been said so that I can dismiss these do-gooders with quick, witty, one-liner.


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## M&M's mummy (Jul 12, 2011)

greengrapes said:


> I'm sorry if this topic has been addressed before, but I am confused with the comments of some people I've talked to about getting a cockapoo.
> I like to do my homework before getting anything new and a new puppy is no exception. I've spoken to lots of people about getting a dog and everyone has there opinion about which breeds are best - fair enough.
> When we decided to get a poodle cross (because of my daughter's allergies) I have been surprised by the number of comments I've had about them being a "Trendy Designer Dog" asking why I'm paying so much money for a mongrel and why don't we get a rescue dog?
> My response with regards to getting a rescue dog has been that I'd like to know the dog's history and make sure that I don't get a dog with any issues. On the cost, surely the cost to raise a litter of puppies is similar whether it's a pedigree or not.
> ...


You have not come from another forum by any chance have you? 

I have not had anything said to my face or out walking but plenty of comments on a forum- which I always address and responses vary depending on my mood or what has been said


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## Rufini (Sep 9, 2011)

I think a lot of cross breeds are considered 'designer' by many because the reason they're crossed it to potentially get the best of both breeds. Although frankly I can't see why this is a negative thing at all, infact I love it!

Members of my family think I have a 'mongrel' and some think I was stupid for spending so much on a 'fake' dog (I have seriously been told this! I mean wtf, fake? Vincent isn't stuffed or anything!!). To be honest I don't even give them the time of day if they think that! 

Also, I have always considered mongrel to be a dog with non distinguishable 'traits' or parenthood - as in you can't tell what breed they even started as. Crossbreed on the otherhand have distinguishable traits from their parents. If you look at the majority of, say,. English working Spaniel x Mini Poodle cockapoos here they all do look very similar!

I say you ignore those people as cockapoos are truely one of the most perfect crossbreeds out there! Intelligant, loving, full of energy, sensitive... and FLUFFY!!  I would rather have a thousand crossbreeds than one 'true' pedigree dog :3


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## greengrapes (Dec 21, 2011)

I won't let these comments change my opinion, but I can't ignore them and want to be prepared, rather than speechless.


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## mandym (Jun 5, 2011)

I have had my fair share of nasty comments over the years and it does upset me but i did a little research and found out dogs like the bichon( originated from a water spaniel and a poodle) an airdale( originated from a welsh terrier and an otterhound) and a sealyham terrier( began as a cross between a dandidinmont and various other terriers!!) these are just a few examples of our pedigrees today,they were all originally crossed with something.i just say the bichon has very similar ancestors as the cockapoo and its a pedigree so whats the difference! if you google different breeds its very interesting,do all those pedigree snobs seriously think their pooch has always looked that way,not a chance.i own both crosses and pedigrees and see no difference at all,just a bunch of gorgeous friendly dogs that are all spoilt rotten xxx


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## Rufini (Sep 9, 2011)

I think the thing to also remember, the Labradoodle is now a recognised breed in Auss, it is likely that this trend will continue!!


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## JoJo (Mar 2, 2011)

I dont see them as Designer Dogs .. they are my pets and I love them 

I know they are priced highly and that doesnt help the designer labelling ...

All I will say .. is find a loving and good breeder, choose your perfect pet and love them for life  

Ignore anti cross breed comments .. the Cockapoo rules on this forum


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## S.Claire (Sep 1, 2011)

mandym said:


> I have had my fair share of nasty comments over the years and it does upset me but i did a little research and found out dogs like the bichon( originated from a water spaniel and a poodle) an airdale( originated from a welsh terrier and an otterhound) and a sealyham terrier( began as a cross between a dandidinmont and various other terriers!!) these are just a few examples of our pedigrees today,they were all originally crossed with something.i just say the bichon has very similar ancestors as the cockapoo and its a pedigree so whats the difference! if you google different breeds its very interesting,do all those pedigree snobs seriously think their pooch has always looked that way,not a chance.i own both crosses and pedigrees and see no difference at all,just a bunch of gorgeous friendly dogs that are all spoilt rotten xxx



That's great information. I haven't had any problems... yet! But i do know there are some snobby, un-informed people out there!! ... I think a Doberman became a pedigree about 100 years ago and was the result of a lot of mixing from German Shepherds, German Pinscher, Danes, Rottweilers etc. 

Do these people just think the different pedigrees just exist just like that? At the end of the day it is a handful of people who get to decide whether a dog is a pedigree or not. Very hoity, toity in my eyes!


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## greengrapes (Dec 21, 2011)

In defence of owners of pedigree dogs, they've all been supportive of our choice. It's the people who say that I should get a rescue dog that are the most forceful in their opinion. 
I agree it's admirable that there are people in the world willing to take on a dog who would be otherwise put down, but I can't understand why I should take any risks with my family by bringing a dog with unknown history and breeding into the house.


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## loobylou (Nov 20, 2011)

Hi!

I too decided upon a cockapoo because of my daughters allergies. She has multiple allergies including dogs and an unknown chemical that has caused an anaphylactic shock which is why I really did my research and spend time with dogs - she's now been with two with no reaction at all 

this isnt a witty one liner but for me it would be an honest answer of - "how much would you pay for the security of your childs health?" give a questioning look and walk away.


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## S.Claire (Sep 1, 2011)

greengrapes said:


> In defence of owners of pedigree dogs, they've all been supportive of our choice. It's the people who say that I should get a rescue dog that are the most forceful in their opinion.
> I agree it's admirable that there are people in the world willing to take on a dog who would be otherwise put down, but I can't understand why I should take any risks with my family by bringing a dog with unknown history and breeding into the house.


Of course and I literally think that is what you need to say. You want a dog where u know its background, have insurance as to any health issues that may arise, know that your family are safe with the dog etc etc. I think it is very admirable that people rescue dogs but at the same time, your family come first. People have no right to tell you what u should or shouldn't be getting. Tell them to butt out!!


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## JoJo (Mar 2, 2011)

mandym said:


> I have had my fair share of nasty comments over the years and it does upset me but i did a little research and found out dogs like the bichon( originated from a water spaniel and a poodle) an airdale( originated from a welsh terrier and an otterhound) and a sealyham terrier( began as a cross between a dandidinmont and various other terriers!!) these are just a few examples of our pedigrees today,they were all originally crossed with something.i just say the bichon has very similar ancestors as the cockapoo and its a pedigree so whats the difference! if you google different breeds its very interesting,do all those pedigree snobs seriously think their pooch has always looked that way,not a chance.i own both crosses and pedigrees and see no difference at all,just a bunch of gorgeous friendly dogs that are all spoilt rotten xxx


Mandy .. all breeds come from somewhere I guess or there would just be one DOG suits all ... I have looked into many other breeders too and yes the ancestry is interesting ...


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## calli.h (Aug 29, 2011)

My Mum had the same reaction when she told her 'breeder friend' that I had bought a cockapoo. My mum expected, as a dog lover, her friend would be happy/interested but no she went nunts about designer dogs and the money it takes to breed 'proper dogs'! It was ridiculous. My parents were successful Afghan and Cavalers breeders/judges and see Arthur and the the breed for the lovely dogs they are. I personally think its all about the money, which is a personal choice for all. 
I was also questioned about why I didnt get a rescue dog and to be honest we did look into this option and were told we could not adopt due to us having a 2 year old daughter and all dogs in our centres were not suitable for under 5's. I would have to wait for a puppy from dogs and backgrounds that I would never be sure of. I also looked into breed rescue centres - again their puppies (if any) had a high price tag attached!! 
Everyone has opinions on everything, sometimes hurtful, sometimes positive I find as I grow older that as long as you know your own mind and your happy with your decisions it doesnt matter what people think. )


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## 2ndhandgal (Aug 29, 2011)

I am one of those odd folk who always rescues as opposed to buying a dog 

I accept that people will buy pups for a variety of reasons and my issue with many breeders of designer dogs is they pedal the line that they don't need as many health tests as they are a cross of two breeds - and then charge the same price as pedigree breeders who have fully health tested their stock.

If I was going to buy a cockapoo the minimum I would be looking for would be PRA tests, hip scores and patella checks for BOTH parents


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## JulesB (Mar 6, 2011)

greengrapes said:


> In defence of owners of pedigree dogs, they've all been supportive of our choice. It's the people who say that I should get a rescue dog that are the most forceful in their opinion.
> I agree it's admirable that there are people in the world willing to take on a dog who would be otherwise put down, but I can't understand why I should take any risks with my family by bringing a dog with unknown history and breeding into the house.


I've had a few comments about why i hadn't got a rescue dog and my answer has always been that as a first time dog owner i didn't want to take on a rescue dog as i wasn't sure if i could handle the demands and training required as i wouldn't know what a well behaved dog looked like but wouldn't rule out a rescue in the future if i could train a dog well. Also i knew i wanted a small, low moulting dog and they aren't always easy to come by as rescues.

In addition, i know from the Battersea Dogs Home i wouldn't be considered for rehoming a dog as i live in a flat and work full time, so a rescue dog would be difficult!!

I've had a couple of snotty remarks about Betty being a cockapoo but i put it down to jealousy!!

x


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## Mrs Hippiechick (Jul 26, 2011)

We tried desperately to get a rescue dog from all the reputable sources: RSPCA, Blue Cross etc. But to no avail ... apparently we are not suitable candidates - living in a rural village with free and easy access to many walks, a loving home, previous dog owners, time and willingness to train and nuture a dog are not (seemingly) what they are looking for. No - the fact that we have cats and work exclude us from being dog owners 

I love the RSPCA and sponsor a dog at the Dogs Trust by direct debit each month, but it saddens me that they have a whole list of reasons why you cannot re-home an animal and not very many reasons as to why you can?

We weren't allowed to re-home anothe cat either ... according to the Blue Cross our road was too busy. It's a one way road that leads to a farm. So yeah, it's as busy as the M1

I chose to ignore (with good grace) anyone who says my baby is a designer dog and that we should have given a rescue dog a chance at life. I assure them that we tried but for now, this is not possible for us. Archie is the light of my life and I really don't care what anyone thinks about our choice. He was my choice and that (to me) is all that matters


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## puppylove (Jul 25, 2011)

greengrapes said:


> I'm sorry if this topic has been addressed before, but I am confused with the comments of some people I've talked to about getting a cockapoo.
> I like to do my homework before getting anything new and a new puppy is no exception. I've spoken to lots of people about getting a dog and everyone has there opinion about which breeds are best - fair enough.
> When we decided to get a poodle cross (because of my daughter's allergies) I have been surprised by the number of comments I've had about them being a "Trendy Designer Dog" asking why I'm paying so much money for a mongrel and why don't we get a rescue dog?
> My response with regards to getting a rescue dog has been that I'd like to know the dog's history and make sure that I don't get a dog with any issues. On the cost, surely the cost to raise a litter of puppies is similar whether it's a pedigree or not.
> ...




I too have had some negative comments about having an expensive mongrel. One standard poodle owner asked me why I didn't just get a poodle if I wanted a non- shedding dog. I never said I wanted a non shedding dog. My response usually goes along the lines of the fact that hearing dogs use cockapoos and I believe even breed their own. Now why would they do that if a pure bred dog would do? All dogs are man made so I don't get their argument. Anyway I have had far more positive attention than negative. You will love owning a cockapoo. Good luck!


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## Pollypiglet (Oct 22, 2011)

I intended originally to get a Labradoodle but was put off by the fact that a lot of breeders had their litters desexed(!) at 8.5 weeks. My vet went into shock when I told him and he said he would raise it with his governing body. He was amazed any British vet would undertake such practice. Anyway a cautionary tale a friend of mine bought a yorkie cross poodle from the web from a breeder in Wales. I went with her to pick up the pup, we had driven over 180 miles the breeder could not get rid of us quick enough. The pup was on its own and obviously distressed. We were shown a group of dogs any of whom could have been the parents. The whole experience was depressing and although the pup has a good home she is not so dependable as her companion who was raised in a stable household. You get what you pay for and there is no substitute for a good careing breeder. On another note I spent ages explaining to my insurance company NFU that Hattie was a cockapoo I could see the receptionists eyes glazing over and when my certfificate arrived she was described as a MONGREL! They will be getting a phone call soon!

P.S.Met a lady out walking the other day who when told Hattie was a cockapoo said "they are very expensive are't they for a crossbreed, my daughter wanted one but could not afford it", I explained that there is alot of time and effort put into breeding a stable sensible dog and from what I have seen breeding is no picnic, people seem to think you leave the bitch to get on with it and reap the rewards when the puppies sell but I know my breeder was working all hours each day to ensure her dogs had a good start in life.


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## JulesB (Mar 6, 2011)

Pollypiglet said:


> I intended originally to get a Labradoodle but was put off by the fact that a lot of breeders had their litters desexed(!) at 8.5 weeks. My vet went into shock when I told him and he said he would raise it with his governing body. He was amazed any British vet would undertake such practice. Anyway a cautionary tale a friend of mine bought a yorkie cross poodle from the web from a breeder in Wales. I went with her to pick up the pup, we had driven over 180 miles the breeder could not get rid of us quick enough. The pup was on its own and obviously distressed. We were shown a group of dogs any of whom could have been the parents. The whole experience was depressing and althopugh the pup has a good home she is not so dependable as her companion who was raised in a stable household. You get what you pay for and there is no substitute for a good careing breeder. On another note I spent ages explaining to my insurance company NFU that Hattie was a cockapoo I could see the receptionists eyes glazing over and when my certfificate arrived she was described as a MONGREL! They will be getting a phone call soon!


My dad always refers to Betty as a mongrel. Usually cos it irritates me!!!


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## ali-s.j. (Jun 6, 2011)

Pollypiglet said:


> On another note I spent ages explaining to my insurance company NFU that Hattie was a cockapoo I could see the receptionists eyes glazing over and when my certfificate arrived she was described as a MONGREL! They will be getting a phone call soon!


Don't complain too loudly - if they classify her as a pedigree, you'll pay a premium!


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

ali-s.j. said:


> Don't complain too loudly - if they classify her as a pedigree, you'll pay a premium!


I agree..Daisy is down as a crossbreed.


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## Pollypiglet (Oct 22, 2011)

PPS! In a previous life I had reason to come into contact with a stray dog who I took to the adoption kennels and as she was not claimed I agreed to take her on. I collected her and she seemed ok and as I had to go to work I left her in my kitchen intending to come back in my mealbreak to let her out and feed her, anyway when I returned 4 hrs later she had jumped onto the work surface and chewed the window frame eventually poping the window open and was gone. Never found her or knew what happened to her. I know there are many rescue dogs who need a home and indeed one of my friends was quite sniffy and said I should rescue a dog but I did research this and they were either all Staffies with "issuse" or terriers with skin conditions or problems with other pets or children. Sorry but too long in the tooth to sort someone elses mess.


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## JR1 (Nov 12, 2011)

Apparently the Cockapoo is a recognised breed by the American kennel club. So it's the UK KC that is behind! Also when I applied for my AXA insurance online, Cockapoo was on the list of breeds. 

Who cares what others think? I saw the posts too but it doesn't mean they are right it's just their opinion. I am happy to have paid loads of money for Poppy and wouldn't put a value on her at all. She is a member of the family and I was happy to pay!

Jane.


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## Pollypiglet (Oct 22, 2011)

Not bothered about the premium just want my girl to be recognised for what she is a great dog with a great personality!


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## mum2bobs (Jun 23, 2010)

greengrapes said:


> I'm sorry if this topic has been addressed before, but I am confused with the comments of some people I've talked to about getting a cockapoo.
> I like to do my homework before getting anything new and a new puppy is no exception. I've spoken to lots of people about getting a dog and everyone has there opinion about which breeds are best - fair enough.
> When we decided to get a poodle cross (because of my daughter's allergies) I have been surprised by the number of comments I've had about them being a "Trendy Designer Dog" asking why I'm paying so much money for a mongrel and why don't we get a rescue dog?
> My response with regards to getting a rescue dog has been that I'd like to know the dog's history and make sure that I don't get a dog with any issues. On the cost, surely the cost to raise a litter of puppies is similar whether it's a pedigree or not.
> ...


I have had this argument so many times on other forums 

I would say this - 

** Trendy Designer Dog? How about the 'designs' of some of the pedigree dogs now suffering with ill health because of how successive breed standards have affected them without anyone complaining about it.

** Paying so Much? It's my money so wind your neck in and mind your own business.

** Get a Rescue Dog? Always a possibility for every dog owner, but not compulsory. Many people get a pedigree pup and not a rescue dog and never get asked this question, so until all dog breeding is stopped and rescue dogs are the only option I will choose what I like.

(As you may be able to tell I get slightly irate by some people's attitudes over this)


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## wellerfeller (Jul 12, 2011)

I have had a few negative comments about weller (far outweighed by the positive though) and have come to the conclusion it is through ignorance! Many of these people have not even laid eyes on a real life, bouncy happy, beautiful, loyal, fun cockapoo let alone spent an afternoon in the company of one. I dare anyone to come away from a few hours with a cockapoo and still call them a ridiculous, non-purposeful designer dog.
As with many things people form an opinion on what they read or are told, not on their own experiences................and they are missing out


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## Laura(L)Izzie (Sep 9, 2011)

greengrapes said:


> In defence of owners of pedigree dogs, they've all been supportive of our choice. It's the people who say that I should get a rescue dog that are the most forceful in their opinion.
> I agree it's admirable that there are people in the world willing to take on a dog who would be otherwise put down, but I can't understand why I should take any risks with my family by bringing a dog with unknown history and breeding into the house.


I know what you mean, I am also on another pet forum (he same one as Shirley) & people forever have this argument. It does my head in tbh! I try not to get too wound up with these people, I don't see why people say 'why don't you just get a poodle?' It does my head in! If I wanted a poodle I would have got one! t the end of the day it's down to people's personal preferences as to which breed we want. It especially annoys me when these people on the other forum start telling prospective owners looking for puppies to get a rescue dog! The problem with this is that a lot of people have young children and therefor don't want that uncertainty. I would never have wanted a rescue dog, I wanted a pup who would know me from being really young & not have any problems. Also i'd like to know where my dog came from & know that it had more chance of being healthy! I would ignore these people, they do my head in & they always try to push their beliefs & ations on to others which I think is wrong.



Mrs Hippiechick said:


> We tried desperately to get a rescue dog from all the reputable sources: RSPCA, Blue Cross etc. But to no avail ... apparently we are not suitable candidates - living in a rural village with free and easy access to many walks, a loving home, previous dog owners, time and willingness to train and nuture a dog are not (seemingly) what they are looking for. No - the fact that we have cats and work exclude us from being dog owners
> 
> I love the RSPCA and sponsor a dog at the Dogs Trust by direct debit each month, but it saddens me that they have a whole list of reasons why you cannot re-home an animal and not very many reasons as to why you can?
> 
> ...


I also don' understand this! There are so many dogs in rescues & they're always saing we need foster hmes & permanent homes for these dogs as rescues are overcrowded blah blah blah, yet when people come forward they bloody turn them down! At the end of the day, if the situation was so bad then they wouldn't be turning down good homes just because people have to work, I do understan the cats & little children things as it's for the families own benefit, BUT just ecause people work I don't think they should be turned down. Rescues don't do things properly IMO, if they did the centres wouldn't be so full & dogs having to be put down :/


Anyway rant over! Just these things really bug me.
As for the pedigree lovers - designer dog haters, tell them where to go  They're either jealous or don't have a clue about the breed  I would ignore them & not worry about their opinions, they're like the KC, crossbreeds are wrong & shoudn't be done on purpose, blah blah! Give me a break


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## M&M's mummy (Jul 12, 2011)

I hate the boring cliches and stereotypical statements that get bounded about.

Like: Why not get a poodle?

or like we had the other day " You know they are not a breed"

or People only get them because they are quirky

or " they do moult!!! "

or everyones an expert because they happen to have come across one in the park 

Or the other fav to go on & on & on about them being called Cockapoos!!!
Had that one the other day too!!!!

I am all for discussing ethical breeding etc.... but leave the digs and rudeness about other peoples choice of dog out of it!!!


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## Hfd (Aug 19, 2011)

We have a kind lady who lives in our road, many moons ago she was involved in the 'dog world' and has showed at crufts. When my hubby told her we were getting a cockapoo she went on and on about cross breeds and mongrels and how it was all so wrong and unnecessary.
Yes you have guessed it - She now can't wait for a Billy cuddle and is amazed at what a lovely personality he has and how well he is coming on. 
I think many comments are made through ignorance, but we all know the secret - that cockapoo's are the best dogs in the world! 
H x


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## Ollie's "mom" (Dec 19, 2011)

To all who contributed to the thread initiated by green grapes, thanks I appreciated your comments, opinions and experiences. I spend most of my time live in a very rural farming community. Here, dogs work, dogs hunt. Many are hounds, many labs. Probably more dogs in the county than people. In this milieu folks first remark on Ollie's behavior-- of course they don't live with him, ;-)then his looks. Folks are interested in learning about the breed. He has spent more time in the swamp than at the beach--there are likely more individuals in Charleston with opinions, however, they are not limited to "designer dogs!!!"


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## Rufini (Sep 9, 2011)

We tried to get a rescue dog too from the RSPCA. As I work full time, and boyfriend part time we were told that because someone won't be in the house 24/7 then we couldn't adopt. We said that we would either hire a dog sitter, or drop the dog off at a doggie day care, but apparently that's not good enough. I just don't understand why they can't assess people in a different way, maybe visiting the home or something! I know it's a hard job adoptiong rescue dogs as some come from a distressing past, but so many people out there want to help!


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## wellerfeller (Jul 12, 2011)

Rufini said:


> We tried to get a rescue dog too from the RSPCA. As I work full time, and boyfriend part time we were told that because someone won't be in the house 24/7 then we couldn't adopt. We said that we would either hire a dog sitter, or drop the dog off at a doggie day care, but apparently that's not good enough. I just don't understand why they can't assess people in a different way, maybe visiting the home or something! I know it's a hard job adoptiong rescue dogs as some come from a distressing past, but so many people out there want to help!



We had a tough time trying to adopt a couple of rabbits last year. I was prepared to pay £30 per bunny, not a problem.
Bought a new hutch and run, double tiered hutch so plenty of room for two small rabbits. Separate run to spend time out in the fresh air eating grass.
Welcomed the home check.
It seemed though after several conversations over the phone that the hutch was too small, it has 8ft living space and the run is also too small at 5ftsq.
I needed to have atleast a 6ft straight hutch and 10 ft run!!!!! Well while it would be great to have that much space to give over to the rabbits, it would leave us with no garden to enjoy. I just think that sometimes great homes are passed over as by the check list they are not quite perfect.
I ended up buying two little rabbits for £10, who are quite happy with their living arrangements.

I can't imagine how hard it must be to adopt a dog.


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## Laura(L)Izzie (Sep 9, 2011)

M&M's mummy said:


> I hate the boring cliches and stereotypical statements that get bounded about.
> 
> Like: Why not get a poodle?
> 
> ...


Exactly Shirley! We hear it all on the other forum haha.
Most people do their research & know that there is always a chance they will moult & we aren't stupid, but people always assume that we just go into the breed blind & have no clue about them.

I agree as well, they're all experts because they've met one on a walk  Never owned one or looked in to them, but experts all the same 

Got to laugh at some poeple's comments on the other forum.


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## greengrapes (Dec 21, 2011)

Laura(L)Izzie said:


> ...Got to laugh at some poeple's comments on the other forum.


Which other forum is this? I want to go and defend the dog I haven't got yet


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## 2ndhandgal (Aug 29, 2011)

I think you are all perfectly entitled to get any dog you want - but I totally fail to understand why so little emphasis is put onto health testing parents and I think the majority of people "attacking" the various crosses are also coming from the same angle.

I honestly don't understand why anyone would pay not far short of £1000 for a puppy where the parents have not been health tested with all the tests appplicable for their breed. I understand breeders may not wish to as it costs them money but I don't understand why people buying pups are not standing up in droves and demanding health tests.

Achieve that and you can then stand tall anywhere and declare your dogs well bred - until you achieve that you are going to face criticism as whether you realise it or not you are being duped and there are pups being sold now who are going to face problems in their futures because of this.


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## M&M's mummy (Jul 12, 2011)

2ndhandgal said:


> I think you are all perfectly entitled to get any dog you want - but I totally fail to understand why so little emphasis is put onto health testing parents and I think the majority of people "attacking" the various crosses are also coming from the same angle.
> 
> I honestly don't understand why anyone would pay not far short of £1000 for a puppy where the parents have not been health tested with all the tests appplicable for their breed. I understand breeders may not wish to as it costs them money but I don't understand why people buying pups are not standing up in droves and demanding health tests.
> 
> Achieve that and you can then stand tall anywhere and declare your dogs well bred - until you achieve that you are going to face criticism as whether you realise it or not you are being duped and there are pups being sold now who are going to face problems in their futures because of this.




You make a very valid point and one that both Sarah and I share hence one of the reasons for us starting our club.

I have learned a lot from "pedigree" breeders despite many a heated debate and in fact we now have support from some of these even though they are not keen on crosses they are supportive of us and our club aims.

I do agree with those who question some of our "cockapoo" breeders and can fully accept why they find it hard that people pay so much for one when some breeders do very little testing.

I have actually changed my own opinion on a lot of things to do with cockapoos and breeding where I have sat down and really though about things and thought to myself " No I no longer find this acceptable....."

I don't however think it necessary to make assumptions that all owners are clueless or don't do their research or some of the other remarks I have heard as in my other post.


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## Laura(L)Izzie (Sep 9, 2011)

greengrapes said:


> Which other forum is this? I want to go and defend the dog I haven't got yet


It's petforums, so it's a forum for all animals & obviously the dog section then has many different breeds. It's a large forum, generally lots going on. 
The cockapoo/doodle arguments aren't quite as bad these days as I think they used to be because they've made rules saying people can't start threads to attack crossbreeds. But they do still occur with some peoples 'opinions' where they aren't needed.


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## Turi (Jun 28, 2011)

This is an interesting post! 

We decided to get a crossbreed because we wanted a dog that would benefit from hybrid vigour and would be less likely to moult – I started our search by temperament and it led me to Cockapoos! 

I am happy paying what others may consider a small fortune for a dog because I know it will have had all the necessary health checks and will be more likely to lead a long, healthy and happy life. 

I wouldn’t consider a rescue dog because I am a novice dog owner and because we have cats. 

I hope I won’t feel the need to justify our decision to anyone else – to be honest I don’t think it’s any of their business. 

Sue (Pollypiglet) – we too investigated Labradoodles and were horrified by the early neutering. I think this only happens with Australian Labradoodles and is to stop them from being overbred. I understand the concept but couldn’t condone such a huge op on such a wee pup. 

Ruth, LOVE your comment about Vincent not being stuffed lol! :laugh:

Turi x


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## JulesB (Mar 6, 2011)

Rufini said:


> We tried to get a rescue dog too from the RSPCA. As I work full time, and boyfriend part time we were told that because someone won't be in the house 24/7 then we couldn't adopt. We said that we would either hire a dog sitter, or drop the dog off at a doggie day care, but apparently that's not good enough. I just don't understand why they can't assess people in a different way, maybe visiting the home or something! I know it's a hard job adoptiong rescue dogs as some come from a distressing past, but so many people out there want to help!


Same situation for me.

My dog walker has just written a reference letter to Battersea Dogs home for a lady who wants to rescue a dog and will use the dog walkers every day she isn't home, i'm not sure if it's done enough to let her rehome a dog though!!


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## 2ndhandgal (Aug 29, 2011)

Turi said:


> This is an interesting post!
> 
> We decided to get a crossbreed because we wanted a dog that would benefit from hybrid vigour and would be less likely to moult – I started our search by temperament and it led me to Cockapoos!
> 
> I am happy paying what others may consider a small fortune for a dog because I know it will have had all the necessary health checks and will be more likely to lead a long, healthy and happy life.


Sorry - can't manage two quotes but a fair bit earlier in the thread I said my minimum for health tests would be:

"If I was going to buy a cockapoo the minimum I would be looking for would be PRA tests, hip scores and patella checks for BOTH parents"

Have you managed to find this Turi - or better maybe?


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## Turi (Jun 28, 2011)

2ndhandgal said:


> Sorry - can't manage two quotes but a fair bit earlier in the thread I said my minimum for health tests would be:
> 
> "If I was going to buy a cockapoo the minimum I would be looking for would be PRA tests, hip scores and patella checks for BOTH parents"
> 
> Have you managed to find this Turi - or better maybe?


No, I don't think so unfortunately. 

Our breeder does the PRA test and another eye test for the curvature of the eye for her Cockers and PRA tests and hips tests her Poodle sires.

You say, 'if I was going to buy a Cockapoo...' Do you not have a one? 

I don't know of any breeder who conducts all of these tests on both parents and I contacted practically everyone on Breeders Online! I stand to be corrected though 

Turi x


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## 2ndhandgal (Aug 29, 2011)

Turi said:


> No, I don't think so unfortunately.
> 
> Our breeder does the PRA test and another eye test for the curvature of the eye for her Cockers and PRA tests and hips tests her Poodle sires.
> 
> ...


Sadly I believe you are correct and there are no breeders meeting my minimum standards  Glad to hear you have found one doing more than the bare minimum though and looking forward to a future where far more testing is done by all breeders.

Yes - I am owned by a cockapoo - but did not buy her - she came to me after having problems in her first home. At the age of 2 she has also just been diagnosed with luxating patella which is a hereditary condition and means she is probably facing painful surgery at some point in her future and will almost certainly be affected by arthritis when she is older.


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## Turi (Jun 28, 2011)

I'm so sorry to hear that - I hope she is not in too much pain 

Turi x


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## 2ndhandgal (Aug 29, 2011)

Turi said:


> I'm so sorry to hear that - I hope she is not in too much pain
> 
> Turi x


Thanks Turi - for the moment she is fine and I am doing all I can to keep her that way for as long as I can!

It does highlight the importance of health testing before breeding though and that is the reason a lot of people will be pretty sceptical about the breeding of designer dogs.


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## Turi (Jun 28, 2011)

I agree with what you’re saying about health testing. 

However, I think it’s a misconception that people who breed full pedigree animals do all the necessary health testing. Just the term ‘pedigree’ can be enough to reassure buyers that the parents’ origins and health will be optimum. You just have to look at the sheer volume of pets for sale online to realise that health testing of pedigree pets doesn’t always occur and this problem isn’t exclusive to the breeding of designer breeds. And don’t get me started on how many pedigree breeds have been overbred… 

People who use lack of health testing to bolster their argument against designer breeds just cannot know all the facts. 

Turi x


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## 2ndhandgal (Aug 29, 2011)

I totally agree Turi and that is why I will proably always take on second hand animals rather than going via a breeder. 

The difference though with the majority of breeds is that is should be possible with care to find a breeder who does all the relevent tests for that breed and is taking care to try and eliminate hereditary problems. As far as I am aware no current cockapoo breeder comes close to this ....


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## Turi (Jun 28, 2011)

2ndhandgal said:


> I totally agree Turi and that is why I will proably always take on second hand animals rather than going via a breeder.
> 
> The difference though with the majority of breeds is that is should be possible with care to find a breeder who does all the relevent tests for that breed and is taking care to try and eliminate hereditary problems. As far as I am aware no current cockapoo breeder comes close to this ....


Me neither... I'm hopeful that the fact that our puppy will be a cross will ensure that some of the ailments common to both breeds will be less likely to occur. 

Turi x


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## MaggieMay (Sep 28, 2010)

I have a Cockapoo, he's nearly 18 months and get this type of thing all the time.

I know he's not a proper breed, i did not want a pedigree dog i wanted a cross breed, i saw that programme on BBC 1 about pedigree dogs and was horrified on how over breed and sometimes inbred pedigree dogs are.

The thing was rescue centre's is the same as trying to foster or adopt children, they say they need more volunteers but then decline anyone who shows an interest for the stupidist reasons.

My mothers friend is the biggest dog snob going and when one of her other friends went to visit with her cockapoo she fell in love with them.

I don't want them to be recognized as a breed because at the moment they are people out there breeding them showing the upmost care and welfare for these dogs, raising them in family environments and raising little stars. Pedigree dogs are in the state they are in because they are breed for looks not health.

yes they have not been around long enough yet to see any long term damage or problems but hopefully with breeders using healthy stock dogs the current pedigree problems will not arrise


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## Sezra (May 20, 2011)

MaggieMay said:


> I have a Cockapoo, he's nearly 18 months and get this type of thing all the time.
> 
> I know he's not a proper breed, i did not want a pedigree dog i wanted a cross breed, i saw that programme on BBC 1 about pedigree dogs and was horrified on how over breed and sometimes inbred pedigree dogs are.
> 
> ...


Sadly they are not all breeding from healthy stock so I do believe that unless we as puppy buyers start to demand more we will see health problems as time progresses.

Sorry to be so negative but apart from a handful of breeders there are not many good ones out there and you cannot rely on hybrid vigour to ensure a healthy dog.


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## carwin (May 5, 2011)

When our old pedigree springer died we looked long and hard for a replacement. We got in touch with the hearing dogs for the deaf and went on their waiting list for one of their fallen angels, but because they now breed their own cockerpoo's they don't get failures so after a year of waiting we got Tilly from a breeder. You can see why they breed their own, she is no problem very inteligent and was easy to train. "far easier than the two springers we had previously".

We got her insured by Buddies and they recognised her as a breed.

All dogs are related to wolf's and pedigree dogs were once cross breeds too.
To those people with that mind set I say BAH HUMBUG :rant:

To everyone else I wish you a very merry christmas.:arty2:


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