# murphy 5 mths and peggy the cockerlier 7 yrs



## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

thought i would put a pic on of our dogs, as have nt put one on of murphy since he was 11 weeks,i may be biased, but arent they a beautiful pair ? x


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## JoJo (Mar 2, 2011)

Lee .. lovely pair, I agree  I think this is the first photo I have seen of your dogs  thank you for sharing with your crazy lady friends lol


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## Cris (Jun 15, 2011)

Gorgeous couple! Makes me want a playmate for Keltie.


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## Sarette (Mar 21, 2011)

Lovely photo xx


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## mandym (Jun 5, 2011)

Hi Lee lovely to see you on the forum.Your dogs are gorgeous,its also lovely to see a pic of your cockalier at long last,lovely pic xxx


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

mandym said:


> Hi Lee lovely to see you on the forum.Your dogs are gorgeous,its also lovely to see a pic of your cockalier at long last,lovely pic xxx


hi mandy, do you remember me from another forum? it took us ages to get murphy, but i am so glad we did he is totally adorable x


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

JoJo said:


> Lee .. lovely pair, I agree  I think this is the first photo I have seen of your dogs  thank you for sharing with your crazy lady friends lol


ha ha problem is i am useless at posting photos! but my daughter helps me, hope to be able to put more on soon x


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## wellerfeller (Jul 12, 2011)

They are lovely!! There is a cockerlier that lives next door but she looks much more cavalier in her face. 
They make a pretty picture together.


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

wellerfeller said:


> They are lovely!! There is a cockerlier that lives next door but she looks much more cavalier in her face.
> They make a pretty picture together.


peggy is working cocker x cav, working cockers look more springer like, which is why she looks springer, i am always being asked how old my springer pup is, because she is quite small.


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## wellerfeller (Jul 12, 2011)

That makes complete sense, Jazz must be show as she is golden in colour with cocker ears but a cav face with a white stripe down her muzzle. Either way they are very pretty dogs.


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

i have had a bit of a shock today. we went to a dog show in suffolk in march, and i brought a dog DNA test kit,well i have the results back on peggy....... she was sold to us as a cocker x cav.... but the results say she is mostly springer, then BRIARD ! saying one of her grandparents would have been pedigree, and lastly, less than 10% cavalier! can you imagine owning a dog for 7 yrs, thinking she is one thing... then finding out she isnt, i feel like i have a different dog! but of course it changes nothing , except my trust in people !


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## mandym (Jun 5, 2011)

crazy lady said:


> hi mandy, do you remember me from another forum? it took us ages to get murphy, but i am so glad we did he is totally adorable x




yes i remember you,its great to see you finally got a cockapoo and a gorgeous boy he is to xxx


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## mandym (Jun 5, 2011)

crazy lady said:


> i have had a bit of a shock today. we went to a dog show in suffolk in march, and i brought a dog DNA test kit,well i have the results back on peggy....... she was sold to us as a cocker x cav.... but the results say she is mostly springer, then BRIARD ! saying one of her grandparents would have been pedigree, and lastly, less than 10% cavalier! can you imagine owning a dog for 7 yrs, thinking she is one thing... then finding out she isnt, i feel like i have a different dog! but of course it changes nothing , except my trust in people !



Which dna test did you use? I recently used a dna test for one of my poodle boys as i was convinced he had a touch of something else in him.they didnt ask any questions or aske for pics,just a swab and he is infact full poodle,felt a right fool lol.Many of the dna tests available ask for details which i think is cheating,i wouldnt trust any dna test that does that xxx


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## Janev1000 (Oct 4, 2011)

I used the same company as Mandy too. Is peggy supposed to from a working cocker? It's just that the company I used said that the DNA markers for a working cocker were the same as a springer so that might be reason why you have that. I'd bought an F1B cockapoo but my test showed that Biscuit was a cockachon x poo, which explained his 'off road' cockapoo body! Everyone had suggested he had bichon in him too - which is why I took the test- and when I tell people now what his mix is they always say that the bichon bit is the most obvious bit they can see! x


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## Rufini (Sep 9, 2011)

ahhhh well I bet it all doesn't matter because it's obvious you love them no matter what! 
They are such a beautiful pair


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

Janev1000 said:


> I used the same company as Mandy too. Is peggy supposed to from a working cocker? It's just that the company I used said that the DNA markers for a working cocker were the same as a springer so that might be reason why you have that. I'd bought an F1B cockapoo but my test showed that Biscuit was a cockachon x poo, which explained his 'off road' cockapoo body! Everyone had suggested he had bichon in him too - which is why I took the test- and when I tell people now what his mix is they always say that the bichon bit is the most obvious bit they can see! x


i used blackdog training, is this the same one? think i will email them and ask if the DNA markings are the same, no i was nt asked for any info or photos before i did the test, they say one of her grandparents was a briard! i guess this could be true, as it does t necessarily mean she would have any characteristics of one, i am finding this all fascinating!


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## Janev1000 (Oct 4, 2011)

I used the Wisdom Panel one, which involved a couple of cheek swabs, which they say provides exactly the same type of DNA cell sample as a blood test. 

There's no doubt we love our dogs no matter what and I have a very strong bond with him but if I am totally honest, if I knew the litter were a bichon mix in the first place, then I would't have gone and looked at them, as I particularly wanted the fast and agile build of a cockapoo. So in that sense, it's naturally a bit of a disappointment when you don't get what you were looking for. I'm sure anyone who finds themselves in the same situation would feel the same. But never mind, we live and learn!! x


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

Janev1000 said:


> I used the Wisdom Panel one, which involved a couple of cheek swabs, which they say provides exactly the same type of DNA cell sample as a blood test.
> 
> There's no doubt we love our dogs no matter what and I have a very strong bond with him but if I am totally honest, if I knew the litter were a bichon mix in the first place, then I would't have gone and looked at them, as I particularly wanted the fast and agile build of a cockapoo. So in that sense, it's naturally a bit of a disappointment when you don't get what you were looking for. I'm sure anyone who finds themselves in the same situation would feel the same. But never mind, we live and learn!! x


well you were obviously meant to have him then! the dna test i used was cheek swabs too,i dont mind at all that she is not what we expected her to be, but i would like to konw if she is working cocker or springer, she only stands 17" to the shoulder, Briards i thought were about 25 " and springers quite large too, although working springers are smaller, oh well i have emailed them questioning if the dna is thesame for springers and working cockers, will have to wait to see what the reply is.


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## Janev1000 (Oct 4, 2011)

I would have thought the DNA markers used were the same with each company, as they all take samples from the same breeds, so maybe the springer in your result really is working cocker. It's certainly interesting! x


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

yes, but it means i have spent £60 , and still wont know which she is!


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## Pinklady (Jun 22, 2012)

Your dogs look so cute! I was wondering about the breeder you got the cockerpoo from?
I think I saw them advertising cocker spaniels, and the pictures were gorgeous. Can you recommend?


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## Janev1000 (Oct 4, 2011)

crazy lady said:


> yes, but it means i have spent £60 , and still wont know which she is!


Give them a call. Wisdom were really helpful with mine and did a number of further tests with my sample to make it as accurate as possible and it kept coming back with the same result. They said that I had sent in a good sample but would have offered a complete re-test if I hadn't for the same price, which I know they have done for others.


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

Janev1000 said:


> Give them a call. Wisdom were really helpful with mine and did a number of further tests with my sample to make it as accurate as possible and it kept coming back with the same result. They said that I had sent in a good sample but would have offered a complete re-test if I hadn't for the same price, which I know they have done for others.


thankyou for that, i was nt sure i was being a bit ott, but i will phone if i dont get a peply via email that sorts this out x


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## Janev1000 (Oct 4, 2011)

Hi Lee Just googled the company you used and they actually use the Wisdom Panel test kits, so you should get good feedback from them - sometimes you have to wait a number of working days for one of the lab team to get back to you. Good luck!


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

Pinklady said:


> Your dogs look so cute! I was wondering about the breeder you got the cockerpoo from?
> I think I saw them advertising cocker spaniels, and the pictures were gorgeous. Can you recommend?


yes murphy came from corrine oconnor, near maldon essex, the kennel name is benbela cocker spaniels, as yes, she breeds these too, i can recommend her highly x


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

Janev1000 said:


> Hi Lee Just googled the company you used and they actually use the Wisdom Panel test kits, so you should get good feedback from them - sometimes you have to wait a number of working days for one of the lab team to get back to you. Good luck!


i have heard back from the lady who put together the report, and this is what i have been told
" there is no possibility peggy is cocker spaniel, the breed database specifically tells closely related dogs apart, different spaniels come back as different breeds, it cannot , however, tell a working line from a show line, they are the same breed"
so i guess she is part springer!
as i said before i am not in the least bit bothered, but it does make me realise that people will lie to get more money out of you! 
thankyou jane, for being so helpful, does the explanation make sense to you too?


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## Janev1000 (Oct 4, 2011)

Biscuit came back as 25% English Cocker Spaniel and they said that the English Cocker Spaniel marker was definitely from show lines and not working. When I asked if there was any possibility that he could be from a working cocker spaniel, they said no, as the working cocker markers were either the same as/or very similar to that of a springer spaniel. I can't remember the exact conversation, as it was on the phone, but it's probably that the working cocker makers are very similar to that of the springer spaniel but they can see a difference between the two breeds. But as far as the cocker spaniel is concerned, they said you can definitely see the difference between a show and a working. Maybe it's different with the Springer with the show or working lines? 

Biscuit was supposed to be from either an American or English Working Cocker (long story!) but came back as English Show Cocker! - which is what I suspected he was and the toy poodle bit came back as bichon. Half of him was right with the poodle though! I'm quite sure there are hundreds of dogs out there that are not quite what their owners think they are!! x


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

Janev1000 said:


> Biscuit came back as 25% English Cocker Spaniel and they said that the English Cocker Spaniel marker was definitely from show lines and not working. When I asked if there was any possibility that he could be from a working cocker spaniel, they said no, as the working cocker markers were either the same as/or very similar to that of a springer spaniel. I can't remember the exact conversation, as it was on the phone, but it's probably that the working cocker makers are very similar to that of the springer spaniel but they can see a difference between the two breeds. But as far as the cocker spaniel is concerned, they said you can definitely see the difference between a show and a working. Maybe it's different with the Springer with the show or working lines?
> 
> Biscuit was supposed to be from either an American or English Working Cocker (long story!) but came back as English Show Cocker! - which is what I suspected he was and the toy poodle bit came back as bichon. Half of him was right with the poodle though! I'm quite sure there are hundreds of dogs out there that are not quite what their owners think they are!! x


so basically you got told the opposite to me! perhaps monday i will go straight to the lab, phoing rather than emailing,, i was told you CANT see the difference between show and working within a breed ..... AAARGH!


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## Janev1000 (Oct 4, 2011)

I can understand how frustrating it is. For me, it was less so, as I did the test because I was sure I could see the hidden breed that came up in the result. In fact, the result was exactly as I had expected. I'm sure if you ask them to run a further analysis then they will. They can run an analysis which is based on what you always thought your dog was compared to the test result and it comes back with whether that could be likely or not, based on common ancestry between some breeds. 

Did you see any of Peggy's parents when you got her?


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

no thats the problem, my husband got her as a surprise for my birthday, and although he had an address, and was told mum(cocker) was there to see, my husband could nt find the location, so rang the man, who said where are you now? my husband had pulled into a mc donalds car park, so the man delivered her there, no questions asked either side, no food sample given- nothing! she was also only about 6 weeks when he said she was ten. ,so not a very god start for her as she was quite poorly with worm infestation. i am wondering if they would rum more tests for free?


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## Janev1000 (Oct 4, 2011)

Ah blame it on the husbands then! My husband found the ad for ours! He's now happy to leave the choosing of poo no 2 entirely to me! Give them a call and ask them if it was a clear sample. If not, then I'm sure they will send you another test kit for a free re-test.


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## wellerfeller (Jul 12, 2011)

Hi Lee if I can grab my neighbour without freaking her out, I will ask her if I can take a picture of her cockalier and post it. I know all crosses even of the same cross can vary but you will see how different to your lovely Peggy she looks, as I have said before you can see that Jazz is from a show cocker and that she has cavalier in her. Might just be interesting for you to compare the two?

Also cockers and springers were once the same, they were just divided into types. You could have both in the same litter! Basically the smaller ones became the cocker spaniels and the large ones springers.


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## crazy lady (Jan 19, 2012)

wellerfeller said:


> Hi Lee if I can grab my neighbour without freaking her out, I will ask her if I can take a picture of her cockalier and post it. I know all crosses even of the same cross can vary but you will see how different to your lovely Peggy she looks, as I have said before you can see that Jazz is from a show cocker and that she has cavalier in her. Might just be interesting for you to compare the two?
> 
> Also cockers and springers were once the same, they were just divided into types. You could have both in the same litter! Basically the smaller ones became the cocker spaniels and the large ones springers.


yes that would be interesting to see! i have always been aware she does nt resemble show cocker, hence why i thought working, and she has lots of feathering on her legs, ears and bottom, i thought like a cav!


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