# Babies and puppies



## fairlie (Sep 7, 2013)

Marzi and I are having fun trying to convince each other that toddlers and puppies are (her view) or are not (my view) a match made in heaven. It's a win win fight because she keeps posting fabulous toddler and puppy shots, but with me posting this thread here to swim amongst the hundreds of "my puppy won't stop biting" threads how could any rational person take her side?

In any case I've started to play a "what would Marzi do" game while I am out and about where I watch mothers of toddlers and try to picture them with crocapoos in tow.

Ok Marzi, to the mother of "Michael meltdown", tantrumming in the grocery store, who will not be able to deposit him straight into his crib at home because puppy desperately needs a walk you would say....?

How about "stitches Sam" waiting in emerg yesterday with his Granny to get a gash in his forehead closed up? Mum no doubt busy at puppy socialization class or getting puppies vaccines done.

On the flip side I had a lovely chat at the hospital with a teacher chaperoning a class from London on a ski trip here. First day out before noon, one child had fallen off the chair lift, a second had broken his wrist and said teacher was waiting for xrays with the third, in an immobilzation device, who had crashed off the trail....all of their mums no doubt happily oblivious back in London and off on walkies with their puppies because they all waited until the children were seven!

As for my own over indulged spoiled brats  who really did get my undivided attention when they were young, you reap what you sow, and now I have my talented, tender, conscientious and devoted daughter here helping me turn eggs, move gates, cook meals and carry on. I still wouldn't do it any other way.


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## Marzi (Sep 17, 2012)

fairlie said:


> Marzi and I are having fun trying to convince each other that toddlers and puppies are (her view) or are not (my view) a match made in heaven. It's a win win fight because she keeps posting fabulous toddler and puppy shots, but with me posting this thread here to swim amongst the hundreds of "my puppy won't stop biting" threads how could any rational person take her side?
> 
> In any case I've started to play a "what would Marzi do" game while I am out and about where I watch mothers of toddlers and try to picture them with crocapoos in tow.
> 
> ...


Your brats had a sibling each to compete with, so did not have your undivided attention - hence not monstrous brats... if they had had puppies as well just think how even much more wonderful they would be 
My kids all say they will definitely have their own dogs when they have their own families 

Puppies plus kids all the way:XD::twothumbs::jumping::star::fencing::behindsofa:


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## 2ndhandgal (Aug 29, 2011)

Unusually for me I am going to take a fence sitting position on this one.

With my rescue head on I see multiple pups given up on and rehomed for the silliest of reasons and far too many families with youngsters being ill prepared and giving up on pups. Molly was raised with two children and in all honestly that was part of her problem as her needs came secondary all the time leading to a dog never exercised, not trained, and ultimately whilst physical needs were taken care of mental needs were not at all leading to an unhappy shut down dog who was rehomed as "too difficult" 

As a dog owner with many many dog owning friends I also see the other side of the story through where thoughtful dog owners are able to bring up children alongside pups to the benefit of both. I remember a small boy coming to dog training classes many, many years ago and knowing the names of every dog, which he was allowed to play with and which not and he has grown into a dog loving responsible adult.

Done right with sufficient thought and care for both species and it can be fantastic for all - done badly it can end very badly indeed, usually for the canine but sometimes for the children as they can end up being bitten. 

Too many people take on pups with no real thought regardless of children or not leading to too many dogs being rehomed or pts for little or no reason


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## Marzi (Sep 17, 2012)

:iagree:

I absolutely agree particularly with your statement: 

*Too many people take on pups with no real thought regardless of children or not leading to too many dogs being rehomed or pts for little or no reason *

The thought is the most important thing... I don't ever want to say that dogs and children are easy. In my experience children are definitely not easy and in comparison dogs can be easier and are certainly better at the unconditional love thing  I had dogs and children because I love dogs. However I also believe that dogs are really good for families, as long as families prioritise the needs of the dogs - so that children are constantly modeled the importance of care, consistency and kindness - they also benefit from being active outside - they get to go to the wood when dogless families are like - 'oh no it is too muddy/ too cold/ too windy etc' and they have that lovely post walk feeling when they are well exercised and full of all they have seen and experienced and are ready to make a happy pile on the sofa - adults, kids dogs - with toast and honey and hot chocolate - every childhood should be made of these sorts of memories.
I think this thread is fairlie having fun with me.... my responses were certainly slightly tongue in cheek - although people who know me well will know that the truth is there too


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## Grove (Oct 17, 2012)

Quite honestly, even with Gandhi being a year and a half and not a little puppy anymore, I often wonder how does anybody have time for children after getting a dog?!


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## Tinman (Apr 23, 2013)

With lots of research, knowing your family, child, and lifestyle - the right dog will fit in with the right family & lifestyle.
It's all about choices and making the right choices......
It worked so well for us to have a puppy when billy was 3, we got another when he was 4!! 
They play wonderfully well together, and sleep on his bed, he adores his dogs - and was very forgiving when Ralph bit him in the wine box!! 
We often laugh at billy playing with Ralph & ruby, especially when billy rolls up into a ball and ruby is all over him trying to get to him.
Ralph knows billy is a great ball thrower and never tires of the game.
I'm with marzi kids & dogs work well together!!
....... I hasten to add..,, the right dog with the right family lifestyle.
I would never dream of getting a larger dog - especially one that comes with an (often undeserved) reputation. X


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## fairlie (Sep 7, 2013)

I am 100% for dogs and kids together, in fact I feel truly sorry for kids without a dog. It is just puppies and toddlers I am on about. :deadhorse:

Wonderful wilderness adventure? Here it takes ten minutes to wrestle a toddler into a snowsuit. By the time you've achieved it you're sweating profusely and inevitably when you finally get outdoors it is bound to need to pee again. We can't "water trees" in 20 below.

Or the reverse, you finally get junior to sleep and collapse on the couch only to have puppy need his fifteenth pee walk of the day.

Or how about teaching the puppy a good recall? The long lead line tangled hopelessly around the pram or tricycle wheels, or off leash the puppy taking off after a rabbit at a mad gallop and mum trying to decide which of her "infants" to abandon.


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## Tinman (Apr 23, 2013)

Fairlie - your stressing too much over minor points.....
Go with the flow,
Both puppy and toddler will pee & poop & eat & sleep when they want to - not when you want them to  usually at opposite times... So guaranteed your none stop 
I appreciate the difference in weather & climates & snow suits etc x


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## Lottierachel (Mar 3, 2013)

Grove said:


> Quite honestly, even with Gandhi being a year and a half and not a little puppy anymore, I often wonder how does anybody have time for children after getting a dog?!


Tilly was 22 months old when Henry was born. A lot of mornings, it would be much quicker to go out to whatever activity we've got going on if we didn't have to take Tilly out first, but that 50 minutes of fresh air every morning does us all the world of good!

Personally, I couldn't do _puppy_ and baby, but that's not to say i disagree with it.

Dog and baby though? I wouldnt have it any other way


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## Marzi (Sep 17, 2012)

Was thinking of one of those moments when the combination of young children and dogs nearly defeated me... We'd just moved down here, Jacob was nearly 4 and Duncan just over 1. Sheba was about 9 and Puff was 1 and a half. Dogs needed walking and I'd sold the idea to J as being a great opportunity to go out on his bike. So D was in the back pack, J was on his bike (getting the bike in the car with the dogs had been something of a challenge, but I'd managed.) We'd driven to the country park - perfect dogs could run free, flatish path for boy on bike. Duncan was yanking my hair and bouncing in the backpack... J looses control of his bike and veers into the middle of a stinging nettle patch. He had on sandals, shorts and a tee shirt... Not happy, wants to be carried, does not want to ride the bike. The car is over a mile away.
Actually, the dogs weren't the problem.... It was the little brother


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## fairlie (Sep 7, 2013)

You've reminded me Marzi of a similar incident with my two where daughter age four was on her bike with training wheels just ahead of me pushing her two year old brother in a stroller. She hit some sort of slope where a driveway met the road and veered into traffic coming from behind us. I shoved the stroller, which flipped, towards the grass and ran out to get her. Thank God in heaven the wife of the man driving saw it all happening and screamed. Her husband slammed on the brakes with a squeal and they watched while I retreived my daughter screaming with terror and her brother, unharmed but hanging upside down and screaming with indignation. Can you imagine what would have happened if crocapup was at my feet all tangled up in his leash?


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## Nanci (Mar 1, 2012)

fairlie said:


> You've reminded me Marzi of a similar incident with my two where daughter age four was on her bike with training wheels just ahead of me pushing her two year old brother in a stroller. She hit some sort of slope where a driveway met the road and veered into traffic coming from behind us. I shoved the stroller, which flipped, towards the grass and ran out to get her. Thank God in heaven the wife of the man driving saw it all happening and screamed. Her husband slammed on the brakes with a squeal and they watched while I retreived my daughter screaming with terror and her brother, unharmed but hanging upside down and screaming with indignation. Can you imagine what would have happened if crocapup was at my feet all tangled up in his leash?


That gave me the heebeejeebees! First of all . . . sorry that happened to you at all, but I was amazed reading this at your quick reaction time to save BOTH of your babies! Just saying . . . . . great job


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## Lottierachel (Mar 3, 2013)

Haha I think those stories confirm my fear that it's not baby and dog that are difficult, it's baby and toddler!! 

P.s. I have FINALLY updated my blog for anyone who follows it http://bisforbaby2014.blogspot.com xxx


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## Tinman (Apr 23, 2013)

Fabulous Lottie - Henry is so scrummy, your blog is just fab! An everlasting ever growing keepsake x
Ps the toy box is lovely...... Your going to need about 10 of those!


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## fairlie (Sep 7, 2013)

What a treat. He is so wonderful and it looks like you are enjoying motherhood. Don't let Marzi and I scare you Lottie, the hassle of a second baby is made up a billion fold by the fact that they will play with and entertain each other for the next twenty years.  Besides Tilly will help you herd them in situations like mine. Had I had a dog attached to the stroller I could have just said "stay" and would have had no fear that it too would roll into the traffic.


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## Marzi (Sep 17, 2012)

My eldest frequently says he wishes he was an only child


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## fairlie (Sep 7, 2013)

I got lucky with my two, they are best friends and have always looked out for each other, aside from one attempt at fratracide very early on. Neither of them want a dog however, on this I feel like a huge failure.


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## Steffie (Jan 8, 2015)

Oh my, I have a new puppy, a 6 month old baby, a 2 year old and a 7 year old....

I think a lot of it depends on the family. In our opinion having a dog is only going to improve our family life. We are a very active outdoor type family, my children love nothing more than exploring in the woods, rock collecting on the beach and getting into their puddle suits and wellington boots when there's puddles to be jumping in. 

Dogs and babies/children for me


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## Marzi (Sep 17, 2012)

Steffie said:


> Oh my, I have a new puppy, a 6 month old baby, a 2 year old and a 7 year old....
> 
> I think a lot of it depends on the family. In our opinion having a dog is only going to improve our family life. We are a very active outdoor type family, my children love nothing more than exploring in the woods, rock collecting on the beach and getting into their puddle suits and wellington boots when there's puddles to be jumping in.
> 
> Dogs and babies/children for me


Hallelujah! You sound like the best sort of mum  Lucky kids, lucky pup, lucky you


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## fairlie (Sep 7, 2013)

Steffie said:


> Oh my, I have a new puppy, a 6 month old baby, a 2 year old and a 7 year old....


....and clearly some sort of metabolism disorder....


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## emjon123 (Apr 9, 2013)

Having a puppy is very much like having a baby! I never wanted a dog, so having a pup when the children were babies was out of the question. Nobody was more shocked than me when one day I realised a cockapoo would be a lovely addition to our family! 

My family were also shocked with my daughter giving the response "I don't want a dog, they are too much trouble and they stink!" She was 22, my son 16!

Anyway Bailey has now completed our family and I do regret not getting one sooner, although, the time was not right for me, I could not have coped with a baby and a puppy, I didnot particularly "like" dogs!! All are true, but Bailey is the best thing as a family I have ever done and my two appreciate her so much it is fabulous to see.

We all see a lot of people getting dogs and they do not have the time or patience to train them and the poor things are rehomed, I often wonder if that would have been me!

No matter what we agree or disagree on about pups and babies/toddlers, pups should never be bought on a whim and are a fabulous addition to anyone's family if the time and effort is put in during puppy hood - just like babies and children. They will grow up to be the best, well adjusted, and lovable addition to any family.


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## DB1 (Jan 20, 2012)

I started out agreeing more with Fairlie and thought not many families are as confident as marzi with having dogs around, then thought maybe its ok if you have had a few dogs before but now I'm feeling that it probably just depends entirely on what the family is like, if they are loving but chilled out (and slightly crazy) and of course dedicated too then I think they could cope with young children and pups. We were not like that and as an older first time mum found suddenly having a young human around was stressful enough (of course i loved him - but the responsibility....!!), that although I had wanted a dog all my life I don't think I would have coped too well, having said that if I was told 'if you don't get one now there will not be another chance' then i would have got one and somehow made it work!!


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## fairlie (Sep 7, 2013)

DB1 said:


> (and slightly crazy)


Yup, agree with this part wholeheartedly.


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## Lexi&Beemer (May 5, 2013)

So I chose puppies over babies. Truthfully I always wanted dogs and kids weren't a high priority. My older sister was just the opposite. Wanted babies, didn't even think about getting a dog. But then her kids got a little older and their friends got puppies and they wanted puppies too. Because they were cute. My sister didn't want to do the work as she is overtaxed with my nieces and all of their activities, so said I should train and housebreak the puppy and then she'd take the dog. I told her that was ridiculous. My nieces spent time with me and my two during their early puppy stages. Once they figured out that they had to do more than just pet it for a bit and run off to whatever else they wanted to do, they were less intrigued with the idea. I think it would be great for the girls to have that kind of love that only a dog can give you. But as they don't have the time to give a dog the love and caring it needs, everyone agreed that at this time it is a no for a dog. It isn't that my sister isn't a dog person. She already has plans to get one once the kids are out of the house. It just doesn't fit for her family now. For my sister and her family, the timing of having both doesn't work. And having been with crazy rambunctious poo puppies taught them that their cuteness sometimes comes with a price. Mostly I think it's being informed about the commitment necessary to have the dog of your dreams as they aren't just born all ready. 


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